#metabrainz

oh sorry

alastairp: Thank you! 🙂

wouldn't a different tracklist justify a new release?

(Or maybe for the main variant.)

not sure it is a good idea or not yet, but we can't go the way of extra data duplication

Leo_Verto: Yeah.

the main problem is that creating one release for each colored vinyl version leads to problems in sharing fixes between releases

indeed

I'm not completely sold on the idea, but I'm also not completely turned away from the idea.

same with "pseudo" transalted trackslists (that was my idea)

well, it is about discussing which alternatives we have to address those issues

some way to note that "these different variants excist" ?

this seems like a pretty significant change that might cause tons of problems downstream for software using MB, if not implemented in a good way

Right now, yes: either Annotations or different Releases.

zas: If more differences are found later on, how would it be handled? split releases?

Leo_Verto: it shouldn't need to break anything if it can be put "on top" of the current level

i deff would not liek diff releases

(we don't really differentiate these now)

wait, let me explain

or would the api return the full, re-duplicated data for a variant?,

let zas explain!

first, a variant only applies when there's no reason to create a separate release

https://musicbrainz.org/release-group/5c153f20-... would probably be one Release but two Variants under zas's scheme.

for example, an artist releases one album, in 3 different vinyl colors, but sharing everything else

or a digital release offered in 3 different formats

Freso: that is a mess and should be merged ¬¬

CatQuest: I disagree. But we can discuss that in #musicbrainz after the meeting.

or, another case, a release of 1000 CDs having each one a different cover art, because hand-made by the artist (i saw this case)

zas: or.. a classical release with its tracklist in german, french and english?

CatQuest: yes

:D

Would that just be one Release and one Variant with 3 alt. tracklists?

*Wouldn't

Freso: I don't want to . I'll be busy

sorry

hmm, how would you determine the "baseline" release? especially in the case of something like different colours

Leo_Verto: one color

baseline release doesn't have "colour" attribute

and variants will override this info, it could be a disambiguation, annotation, or any field "allowed"

cover art cn be uploaded probably.

CatQuest: we use disambiguation&annotation atm

yea i know

so, atm, we create one release for each vinyl color

duplicating all the data

but recordings

zas: You think this can be wrapped up somehow in the next 2-5 minutes?

we do? I thought this was dissuaded

i finish

CatQuest: We do, yes.

my idea is to be able a release a variant of another if they share enough data

Since the medium colours makes the cover art different.

last i heard sep coloured vinyl was not extra release. oh ok

and to be able to make a "full" release any variant at anytime

each "variant" has a release mbid

zas: it's also true atl east for modern cd+digital releases that they literlaly share anything

but it gets part of its data from another release

i cna see it work, if combined with alt tracklists also

and we just override data that differs

CatQuest: yes, about cd vs digital

in most cases

The whole concept makes my head hurt right now. :)

same concept. of "base date and thne whatever's diff jut gets overwritten

that's all, we can let people think about it, and discuss this on next meeting ;)

i kidna like it. it seems a diferent way of thinknig aobut releases at lal ,but i think (esp ) with the future of digital and altering things it might be a very important thing aobut howt ogo forward aobut restructuring data

zas: Maybe you can try and make a more "formal"/in-depth specification of it or something and post on the forums in its own topic maybe?

Freso: yes, i'll try to find time for it

zas: What happens when you edit details of a full release with variants. Are new values propagated to variants or old values saved into variants?

Alright, great. Thanks zas! :)

i visualise it like a release is a paper and a variant is a transaprent sheet with soem alterations on it wich is laid ontop

I think we started planning the '17 summit around this time last year (at least according to the wiki history) so I'd like to get started talking about this year's summit.

Is there even going to be a summit this year? Is it going to be in Barcelona again? Do we have any date in mind? (Maybe there is a convenient referendum again :P)

the "master" release changes are propagated to variants

in fact, they arent

the "master" release data is shared with variants ;)

Leo_Verto: Thank you for inviting us to your home city. :)

Leo_Verto: It will probably be in BCN again, but we might not be able to determine too much without ruaok.

The summit has been late summer/early autumn for the last several years, so it should likely be in that period this time again.

Or we could just decide on a date and tell ruaok "sorry, missed it so we decided it for you" :p

(but yeah, ok, waiting for him might make sense)

i like to have the summit after the GSoC end

Okay, I can't remember how we came up with the date last year but I'd love to have something concrete for my autumn planning

Depending on where we end up, we may prefer it to be a bit earlier or a bit later. (E.g., for Barcelona, we'd prefer it a bit earlier, for Germany/Scandinavia, we'd prefer it a bit earlier.)

That's pretty much it for this topic, I just wanted to get this rolling

I vote for a summit in India ;)

+1 after the GSoC

Leo_Verto: Yeah. Let's keep it in the topic and poke Rob next week whether he has any travel plans for that time that needs to be considered.

+1 India :p

Indian summit would be amazing.

Anyway. I think that's it for tonight then.

Thanks for your time everyone! :)

</BANG>

Thanks !

-1 to india

I'd like to come to Europe again😂

^ ditto :P

Reo we will get you lays.

iliekcomputers: you can still come to EU, when you want ;)

iliekcomputers: I'm sure you'll come back soon enough. Don't cheat us Europeans from coming out of Fort EU a bit. :p

Indian lays in Europe sound better. :p

Freso: luckily for us, the UK will help with it soon

Let's go to Thailand or Vietnam or Malaysia then :)

Oh well, enough for now

reosarevok: I don't think the UK is very high up on the list for summit locations though.

bukwurm_: recently there has been some discussion on #irc:matrix.org about bridge latencies going haywire recently, especially joins seem to be a problem

my personal theory is that the join is lost for whatever reason and the bridge then drops all messages from that user because it doesn't think they joined yet

Don't EU guys need a visa for UK now ? ;))

zas: Not yet. UK is still in the EU.

that might explain why it's always different users whose messages are dropped

the matrix > IRC direction isn't affected at all afaik

samj1912: ...

except for the lag

Don't get shot - anywhere - please.

UK was in EU ... damn ;)

Freso: 😂❤️

the US is pretty much a VISA hell for everyone other than bitmap though, isn't it?

Leo_Verto: Not really.

samj1912: +1

It's really easy as an EU citizen to get a tourist "visa".

Leo_Verto: its easier to get an US visa than an european one from my experiences :P

I spent all of about 5 minutes on it when I went to CA for the GCI thing two years ago.

AFAIK, MajorLurker spent about the same.

Leo_Verto: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_System...

CatQuest: I goof up the slashes all the time :/

ugh my conenctino went silently off before leo wrote his pice

:// i was liek "who noone talking?"

Leo_Verto: I think there it is something else.

we had a chicago mini-summit at the beginning of 2014 when the entire city was snow/slush, was pretty fun

Because I am able to reference the users in the matrix.

Had they not joined, I don't think it would have been possible.

maybe we can say "for meetings, please try to use a differnt client thna matrix" or something

Ok, but today I am still unable to reference kartikey.

idk

CatQuest: Maybe, yeah.

Last time it was akhilesh , but I was able to reference him using @... completion.

bukwurm_: Yeah, Matrix is really its own thing, which just happens to be able to interface with IRC, but IRC will always be a "secondary" "citizen" to Matrix itself.

I hope it gets fixed, because it's such a great way to stay online irc constantly. :(

ircloud