IMO, should move the ISWC column after type and language
2014-05-06 12615, 2014
kepstin-laptop
the later are probably more important
2014-05-06 12608, 2014
kepstin-laptop
might actually make sense to merge the ISWC and attributes columns (i.e. treat iswc as an attribute)
2014-05-06 12632, 2014
navap
What are attribute again?
2014-05-06 12606, 2014
kepstin-laptop
stuff like jasrac id, key, raga, etc.
2014-05-06 12624, 2014
navap
Oh right
2014-05-06 12604, 2014
kepstin-laptop
hmm. I've never really liked the way that bootstrap line-wrapped tabs look
2014-05-06 12604, 2014
nikki would rather see attributes as columns (and a way of deciding which columns to show)
2014-05-06 12654, 2014
nikki
like type, raga and tala are all pretty irrelevant to me, but I'd generally like to see jasrac id and iswc... non-japanese editing people probably couldn't give a shit about jasrac ids :P
2014-05-06 12607, 2014
navap
+1 to that, but maybe for later....
2014-05-06 12619, 2014
nikki
so in the meantime I'd just leave it as it is
2014-05-06 12657, 2014
kepstin-laptop
well, reordering language before iswc so it's more visible on phone screens probably still isn't a bad idea :)
2014-05-06 12607, 2014
nikki
that makes sense, yes
2014-05-06 12640, 2014
navap
It makes sense to go through and optimize column order in a lot of places
2014-05-06 12630, 2014
navap
Since we brought up the footer, what do we do with it and all those links?
2014-05-06 12602, 2014
hawke1
nuke them from orbit?
2014-05-06 12623, 2014
navap
Well google analytics does suggest no one uses most of those links...
2014-05-06 12648, 2014
nikki
getting rid of h1-sized headings would help
2014-05-06 12608, 2014
navap
heh and I just decreased all of the heading sizes earlier today
2014-05-06 12620, 2014
nikki
(they're h2s, it seems, but for some reason the h2s are the same font size as the h1s)
2014-05-06 12637, 2014
kepstin-laptop
at the very least, remove everything but about, contact, and maybe developers
2014-05-06 12645, 2014
navap
The headers in the footer are 16px, whereas regular text is 12 px
2014-05-06 12656, 2014
hawke1
+1 kepstin…I was just working on saying basically that. ;-)
2014-05-06 12637, 2014
nikki
both h1 and h2 are 25px for me
2014-05-06 12602, 2014
navap
nikki: Sounds like a caching issue
2014-05-06 12606, 2014
hawke1
kepstin: All the rest could go in a single 'documentation' page, yeah — a landing page on the wiki that can take you to all that other stuff.
2014-05-06 12644, 2014
nikki
navap: same in chrome and I haven't loaded it in chrome before
2014-05-06 12639, 2014
navap
h2's should be 18px and they're now 12px in the footer
2014-05-06 12622, 2014
navap
I reduced h2's from 25px to 18px a few hours ago. Have you ever loaded my sandbox in chrome? I still think it's a caching issue
2014-05-06 12651, 2014
derwin
I wish that the new pop up artist stuff
2014-05-06 12653, 2014
derwin
wasn't just over one page in size
2014-05-06 12600, 2014
derwin
so that I don't have to click outside of the modal
2014-05-06 12602, 2014
derwin
and then page down
2014-05-06 12604, 2014
nikki
uh, possibly weeks ago?
2014-05-06 12605, 2014
derwin
and then inside the modal
2014-05-06 12606, 2014
derwin
and then page down
2014-05-06 12604, 2014
nikki
same in firefox..
2014-05-06 12607, 2014
nikki
loading safari now
2014-05-06 12616, 2014
navap
Is anyone else seeing 25px h2's?
2014-05-06 12607, 2014
nikki
safari is the only one which hasn't
2014-05-06 12630, 2014
nikki
I could maybe understand it in opera, but why the fuck would chrome and firefox be loading weeks-old (at least) cached stuff?
2014-05-06 12658, 2014
hawke1
I show 16-px in chrome's document inspector
2014-05-06 12614, 2014
ianmcorvidae
LESS compiles it to localStorage, which is very annoying
2014-05-06 12617, 2014
ianmcorvidae
this may be related
2014-05-06 12621, 2014
kepstin-laptop is definitely getting 16px in his firefox
2014-05-06 12651, 2014
ianmcorvidae
if you open a console and run localStorage.clear() that'll ensure it, anyway
2014-05-06 12604, 2014
kepstin-laptop
it's a pity that firefox has no UI to view or clear local storage yet :/
2014-05-06 12625, 2014
nikki
will that clear it for all sites or only the current one?
2014-05-06 12629, 2014
ianmcorvidae
just the current
2014-05-06 12653, 2014
ianmcorvidae
fwiw, doing so on navap.mbsandbox for me changed them from 25px to 18px (along with a page refresh of course)
2014-05-06 12630, 2014
nikki
it seems like it's a bit pointless having the in-browser compiling stuff if it means you can't just edit the styling as you like anyway
2014-05-06 12631, 2014
navap
Wow, chrome shows I've got a ton of different common.less cached from jan 30th
2014-05-06 12640, 2014
ohrstrom joined the channel
2014-05-06 12655, 2014
navap
Whenever I edit the less I just regular refresh chrome and it works right away
2014-05-06 12605, 2014
navap
I haven't run into cache issues
2014-05-06 12642, 2014
ianmcorvidae
it seems to be fairly finicky in terms of when it does and doesn't bother to refresh things
2014-05-06 12645, 2014
nikki has just got into the habit of using the compiled one and then doing touch lib/DBDefs.pm
2014-05-06 12631, 2014
navap
If I had to wait for my server to restart each time I edited the less I'd quit... :(
2014-05-06 12654, 2014
navap
Where my server == rika
2014-05-06 12656, 2014
nikki
downloading all the less files isn't very fast anyway :P
2014-05-06 12623, 2014
nikki shrugs
2014-05-06 12659, 2014
nikki
it seems problematic though if you can never be sure other people are seeing what you are
2014-05-06 12612, 2014
navap
Oh yeah, hang on, I'm tacking on a timestamp to the less file so that you should always get the latest version. So I wonder how you ended up with that cached version
2014-05-06 12641, 2014
Freso
kepstin-laptop: Heh. I was trying to figure out where "pity" was a pain in.
2014-05-06 12611, 2014
kepstin-laptop is missing some context for that
2014-05-06 12629, 2014
navap
hawke1, kepstin-laptop: Given that the footer height is the same now that I've removed the extra taggers section, does it still make sense to remove more of the columns?
2014-05-06 12654, 2014
navap
Or rather the footer height won't change by removing more columns
2014-05-06 12658, 2014
kepstin-laptop
you could make the links in each section multiple columns to make the footer wider and less tall
2014-05-06 12633, 2014
misterswag joined the channel
2014-05-06 12652, 2014
hawke1
navap: I guess nikki might be the one to say if it’s short enough now.
2014-05-06 12643, 2014
Freso
kepstin-laptop: "it's a pity that firefox has no UI to view or clear local storage yet :/"
2014-05-06 12656, 2014
nikki
well, the headers are still gigantic for me
2014-05-06 12602, 2014
nikki
but fewer links is good
2014-05-06 12633, 2014
nikki
it would probably also help to have one footer, not two :P
2014-05-06 12626, 2014
nikki
I wonder if "downloads" is a good idea... we already get people who think we're providing music downloads, I thought
navap: I feel like body needs some margin on left and right sides
2014-05-06 12612, 2014
nikki
still getting gigantic headers... the sections feel a bit too spread out now though
2014-05-06 12626, 2014
nikki
(maybe centred would be better)
2014-05-06 12622, 2014
nikki
I dunno...
2014-05-06 12609, 2014
nikki
when I said I agreed with removing links, I wasn't quite thinking of leaving a small selection at the top and dumping loads of others at the bottom instead
2014-05-06 12607, 2014
hawke1
I would be fine with removing a bunch more links — maybe keep the three kepstin mentioned (about, contact, developers) as links to /doc landing pages for each?
2014-05-06 12617, 2014
hawke1
(and have nothing under them)
2014-05-06 12649, 2014
navap
Only providing links to those pages is just repeating the top menu though
2014-05-06 12618, 2014
hawke1
Not really — those are (presumably?) less-used links.
2014-05-06 12639, 2014
hawke1
i.e. top bar is for editors to actually do stuff, while the bottom is reference stuff
2014-05-06 12640, 2014
navap
Offtopic: What's a word we could use to describe both customers and sponsors?
2014-05-06 12601, 2014
nikki would just link to those from "about" anyway
2014-05-06 12602, 2014
hawke1
partners?
2014-05-06 12638, 2014
hawke1
(that feels like kind of a loaded business-word which might imply more than it really is, but…)
2014-05-06 12652, 2014
nikki
supporters?
2014-05-06 12617, 2014
hawke1
Hey, I’m a supporter. :-p
2014-05-06 12649, 2014
navap
hawke1: And you're listed buried in the small print on the sponsors page ;)
2014-05-06 12652, 2014
hawke1
(I would tend to associate 'supporter' more as people who donated or something, not customer)
2014-05-06 12654, 2014
hawke1
am I?
2014-05-06 12610, 2014
navap
Oh wait, that's just donaters
2014-05-06 12631, 2014
hawke1
which is a line-item on sponsors I guess
2014-05-06 12653, 2014
Freso
I don't think "Partners" would be a bad word.
2014-05-06 12606, 2014
Freso
Sure, it's business-y, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.
2014-05-06 12619, 2014
nikki
partners seems wrong to me
2014-05-06 12619, 2014
Freso
And there are many ways to be a "partner".
2014-05-06 12638, 2014
hawke1
I think it would be OK, but sometimes it implies … working-together-on-a-joint-project-in-something-formal.
2014-05-06 12645, 2014
Freso
"Money sources"
2014-05-06 12604, 2014
nikki
to me it implies we're working together, which isn't the case if someone just donates money in the way that sponsors do, nor is it the case for most of our customers
2014-05-06 12631, 2014
nikki
I dunno, why are you even looking for a single word, navap?
2014-05-06 12639, 2014
Freso
hawke1: Which we do! We work together in that they provide MeB funds to run MB.
2014-05-06 12659, 2014
hawke1
Freso: yeah — it’s not a bad word at all.
2014-05-06 12611, 2014
Freso
(Which is not an uncommon type of partnership in the business world, IME.)
2014-05-06 12615, 2014
navap
nikki: To find a way to remove one of the links in the footer for you :p
2014-05-06 12626, 2014
nikki
remove both, link to them from the about page? :P
2014-05-06 12657, 2014
navap
I want to give them as much visibility as possible. Customers add legitimacy to us
2014-05-06 12609, 2014
hawke1 notes that the 'donate' page is not easy enough to find. :-)
2014-05-06 12616, 2014
bitmap
or just name the link Customers & Sponsors or something :P
2014-05-06 12619, 2014
navap
Side note: I'm moving those two pages into the MB namespace
2014-05-06 12633, 2014
nikki
I can't say I've ever gone "I really need to know who metabrainz's customers are! oh, thankfully musicbrainz links directly to it from every single page!" :/
2014-05-06 12634, 2014
navap
bitmap: Yeah, but then what's the url?
2014-05-06 12658, 2014
Freso
nikki: Sure. But you're already part of MB.
2014-05-06 12610, 2014
bitmap
well, I thought you were combining them somehow anyway since you wanted a single word
2014-05-06 12638, 2014
nikki
Freso: I can't say I've ever gone to any site and needed to find a direct link to their customers
2014-05-06 12652, 2014
navap
bitmap: I think I'm not too sure on what I want to do with those two words/pages...
2014-05-06 12628, 2014
nikki
I'd either expect it as part of some "about" text or on the main page
2014-05-06 12611, 2014
navap
nikki: You're also not someone who is willing to pay thousands of money per year on music data
2014-05-06 12621, 2014
navap
thousands of dollars*...
2014-05-06 12629, 2014
ianmcorvidae
heh thousands of money
2014-05-06 12601, 2014
navap
s/willing/looking/ is probably more accurate
2014-05-06 12618, 2014
kepstin-laptop could spend thousands of japanese yen per year on music data without issue ;)
2014-05-06 12620, 2014
kepstin-laptop
why don't we have a single 'about' link that brings you to a page with info about musicbrainz, people, and a customers section?
2014-05-06 12622, 2014
navap
On the topic of customers, what are people's thoughts of showing some logos on the home page?
2014-05-06 12629, 2014
nikki
I guess what I'm saying is that it feels out of context, it's not really a page designed to get people to give us money (that's probably closer to "donate"), nor is it really promotion, since it's just a link sitting there where almost nobody will click it
2014-05-06 12609, 2014
hawke1
I’d expect to see it maybe on the front page, but not in the footer of every page
2014-05-06 12617, 2014
nikki
yeah
2014-05-06 12630, 2014
navap
hawke1: Logos? Yes that's all I had in mind
2014-05-06 12651, 2014
nikki
but yes, I'm not a big company and definitely don't understand how they think :P
2014-05-06 12653, 2014
hawke1
navap: some sort of Customers heading with highlights.
2014-05-06 12626, 2014
hawke1
Something like what community/database/developers is on the front page now.
2014-05-06 12646, 2014
hawke1
Just saying I wouldn't necessarily expect it on every page.
2014-05-06 12644, 2014
navap
Can someone tell me which language link/box to use? Bordered or unbordered?
2014-05-06 12625, 2014
ianmcorvidae
navap: I hadn't looked before, do you have a link handy for what the two look like?
where it's sitting right now it doesn't look like it's clickable unless it's bordered
2014-05-06 12652, 2014
ianmcorvidae
so what I'd say is
2014-05-06 12613, 2014
ianmcorvidae
if it's going to be isolated away from other menuy things then border, if it's alongside other things that are obviously links, unbordered
2014-05-06 12639, 2014
navap
I've removed the sponsors/customers links and also moved some of the links at the bottom up into the big footer. All that I've got left is a link to donate and to twitter
2014-05-06 12640, 2014
ianmcorvidae
(well, the arrow would help with making it clear it's clickable without the border, but I think I'd still go with the border for that)
2014-05-06 12653, 2014
navap
Bordered it is.
2014-05-06 12627, 2014
kepstin-laptop
you definitely need 1px dotted borders around everything
