#musicbrainz-devel

so, I either need to gut a contractors agreement and only leave the confidential bits and have someone sign that.

or we wait until I hire a sysadmin.

and at this point I would like to hire an admin, rather than doing things like upgrading jira myself.

OK

"Melodic Death Metal"

I had no idea that was a thing.

Bit of an oxymoron

yeah

Melodeath is totally a thing!

kloeri: Is channel redirection something a channel founder/admin can set up via chanserv?

(I'm looking at chanserv commands, but am not seeing anything that appears obvious to me.)

reosarevok: Freso: hello, who can request a freenode mb/user cloak for me?

navap was the right one at some point, dunno if still is

He is still the one. I was trying to get permissions/access/something to it, but that process seems to have stalled.

Ominous Nefarious Expert.

Freso: you should be able to mlock a channel +if #otherchannel

kloeri: Ah. Thanks. :) I guess that won't move people already in the channel though, right?

it won't

Okay. It'll be alright though, I think.

and some clients refuse to follow channel forwards but those are kinda rare

kloeri: They'll just get locked out of the channel then.

indeed

ruaok: So, having been informed by kloeri and digging into more Chanserv docs too, I should be able to begin redirecting channels around (e.g., finally closing #musicbottle for real) once we settle on what channels to keep/make. I vote for #musicbrainz + #metabrainz for now, but you have also talked about a #metabrainz-devel channel. I just "fear" that #metabrainz will be dead if -devel stuff is

supposed to happen in #metabrainz-devel. I don't know.

I see your point and I agree.

so #musicbrainz and #metabrainz-devel or just #metabrainz?

I kinda like the -devel designation

I think -anything is what you use when that topic makes other discussions in the main channel hard to follow. e.g. some irc channels have -offtopic in addition to their main channel, etc..

not having a main channel seems weird

not having a -devel channel is also weird.

only in mb land, most free software projects just have one channel :)

s/,/./

heh

Yeah. I also think not having a -devel is fine. Far most projects have just the one channel. #musicbrainz just happens to be big enough on its own to warrant a "break out" channel.

ok, thats fine by me.

let's finalize this split next dev meeting

depends on the size of the project I think (and to some extent the type of project)

large projects often find that the normal user support gets a bit noisy when all you want is to discuss development issues and vice versa

but for musicbrainz just having one channel would likely work quite well imo

mb seems to be one of these wonderful projects where everything often flows together - somebody asks how to annotate some information correctly and then it moves from pure support to more development oriented discussions of how to represent some new bit of information and everybody goes home happy :)

I'd be happy to move #musicbrainz-devel into #musicbrainz too, but I do think that all the other *brainz should likely be kept out of #musicbrainz*

is there a natural split? and is that how people actually work? <- that's what I'd be asking myself

#musicbrainz and #musicbrainz-devel seem fine as seperate channels, #musicbrainz gets a lot of editing discussion which may be more difficult if it is interleaved with development stuff.

if anything #musicbrainz-devel should be renamed to #metabrainz-devel if you want to move all development discussion to one place.

hm, to me it seems better to keep dev talk in a -devel channel

yeah

(though I personally like that e.g. bookbrainz development discussion is seperate from #musicbrainz-devel)

mhm, keeping all the dev talk in one place makes it a lot harder to just read the backlog for one project

Leo_Verto: that is the thing to balance.

not too dead, but not too busy is the ideal.

Leo_Verto: According to http://chatlogs.metabrainz.org/brainzbot/bookbr... there hasn't been any traffic in #bookbrainz-devel for three days.

yep

Freso: which is great!

wouldn't consider that channel dead though

Well, to anyone having joined the day before yesterday, it would appear to be. :)

Freso: because it is easy to keep with, and it gives me an idea what's going on with bookbrainz. With MB I have no idea, because it's too busy to follow.

But why would normal users join -devel channels anyways? :P

And if someone wrote something in there, they would get a reply pretty quickly, because it's easy to find it in the backlog/weblogs

kuno: What would you like in your cloak, kuno or warp?

* Freso renames "Chat logs" for now, which seems to be the path most easily reversible

maybe "chat bot" ? aince that'd be any thing that we use ot log things?

just an idea

Freso: You're now a founder for #musicbrainz, #musicbrainz-devel, #metabrainz

ruaok: I added you to #metabrainz, you already had the other two

thanks!

ok, time to head out and see about these independence shenanigans.

Gentlecat, here we come!

there's probably a lot of people

be careful :P

Have fun

[16:15] <kuno> if anything #musicbrainz-devel should be renamed to #metabrainz-devel if you want to move all development discussion to one place.

<-- I agree with that

Mineo: Your wikidata bot may be stuck again. It hasn't edited for a day...

ruaok: I did sort of consider looking into the FreeDB gateway update (it’s dangerous, I know).

Apart from accessing the server, I was wondering how I could get a replication access token “for MetaBrainz”.

(Or can internal servers download packets without a token?)

navap: kuno

navap: thanks!

CatCat: That's a good idea. I'll go and do that. Maybe "IRC bot" instead of chat bot, just to be explicit. :)

kuno: Are you identified to kuno right now?

navap: "20:13:28 freenode -- | [kuno] is logged in as kuno" - so yes.

hi Gentlecat

how are festivities?

hello

very crowded

with some strange music

yeah, many catalans don’t like their folk music either ;)

I’m ready to merge sqlalchemy into lb

I wanted to do one more test to see when it opens and commits transactions

do you know anything about turning logging on for postgres?

not really

but there's logging for sqlalchemy

probably not enough

I bet it’ll hid some bits

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/722221/how-t... is what I want

perhaps this will work. let me see

basically, I’d like to see BEGIN and COMMIT happen

this will be more important when I port to messybrainz, where we have some double-queries that must happen inside the transaction

I don't really remember if this logging stuff gives you that

should be easy to check though

yeah, this is why I was going to go straight to postgres

12 # Be careful when importing `_connection` before init_connection function is

13 # called! In general helper functions like `create_cursor` or `commit` shoul\

out of date comment

2015-09-11 20:21:14,392 INFO sqlalchemy.engine.base.Engine BEGIN (implicit)

OK, sqlalchemy logging is working. thanks for pointing me there

one more thing regarding the lower() stuff we do - if we have to stay with lower, we should create function indexes, because this will get slower and slower