#musicbrainz

the what?

before mediawiki, mb used moinmoin. so some of the earlier style decisions and discussions are there.

Haha. That's brilliant. :)

iirc, it was at oldwiki.mb.o at one point, but not anymore.

Freso: It'd be better if he was naked :P

(of course you can't sell that in Japan)

Does the -original.jpg for SoundCloud images not work in general, or is it just this one that's not working for me? ( https://i1.sndcdn.com/artworks-000107421688-ted... → https://i1.sndcdn.com/artworks-000107421688-ted... )

+anymore

Freso: 403 Forbidden

pbryan, it/when you have time, can I pick your brain about the history of theatre style?

Sure.

Hit me!

oh, also, "hi". I forget that part sometimes.

:-)

Hi!

Psh. "Hi" is inefficient!

Just get straight to the point and get out.

You need questions with punch!

So, pre-NGS, theatre style said to use "composer" for the artist. I assume this was to avoid collaboration artists with the lyricist.

and now to be stuck in my head that song is

Yes, in most cases, musical theatre releases are associated with composer, like Andrew Lloyd Weber.

And there was a controversial white list of collabs for "well known" writing duos.

Yes.

Post-NGS, that whitelist finally became official.

The rationale for that is they are so well known as a collaboration.

Nobody refers to The Mikado as Sullivan, it's Gilbert & Sullivan.

right, understood

It's the post-NGS part I don't understand.

Ah, that's around the time I became scarce.

I was around for the whitelist; I was an advocate of it.

That's why I'm bugging you.

:-)

What I don't get is, once we had ACs, why go with the whitelist? collab artists were no longer a problem.

IIRC, the thinking was the shortening of the names in the ACs.

William GIlbert as Gilbert

And the release artist is still composed of artists, so how that was to be represented.

Unfortunately, it's made finding the collaborations difficult, because AFAIK, there's no way to search for both.

yeah, understood

the point of my question is, does the explicit "composer only, no lyricists" guideline for theatre make sense anymore?

Hmm.

i mean, that's not my question to you. it's my question to everybody.

For RA, I'd say probably yes?

Phantom of the Opera is by whom?

Andrew Lloyd Webber

"Unfortunately, it's made finding the collaborations difficult, because AFAIK, there's no way to search for both." - search what? There should be ways, both for finding specifically named ACs and also for finding release( group)s and recordings with multiple specific artists.

Do we think of the lyricist. Should Hart be up front?

(Maybe it's harder to find "clickably", but certainly not machine-searchably.)

Oh, to be clear, there are two aspects to this question.

Freso: Is there a way currently to select more than one artist for a search and only receive results that includes both?

1. how do you credit releases that don't explicitly credit anybody on the cover?

pbryan: "arid:MBID1 AND arid:MBID2" using advanced search.

2. does that also apply to releases where the composer/lyricists *are* credited explicitly on the cover?

Right, I tend toward a solution that favours how the artist(s) are credited on the cover, or where it's demonstrably well known to be credited as such.

IIRC, I was arguing against Composer-only to get the whitelist added, because it would have removed useful information. At the time I made the case of "commonly known collaborations" but cover credit makes sense too.

Freso: Cool! Thanks, I'll definitely use it.

(Is using arid: a lot in work searches right now. :|)

Also, I just went and added a bunch of Sullivan (with and without Gilbert) works to the db.

And I'm not sure what artist intent is when it comes to such cover credits. It may be someone comes along and re-releases something with different cover credits, so it's not always going to be cut and dried.

Freso: why not just go to the artist's realationship page? (ok, that doesn't work with aliases, but)

reosarevok: ?

sorry

advanced search is good. you can also filter releases by AC from the artist page.

I meant, that if you want to find works from artist X, I've found just going to their relationships tab (which lists all relationships with no pagination) pretty useful

pbryan: generally, artist credits credit who's credited

Sorry guys, gotta jet. I'll be back tonight sometime. Hope it helps. I'll be happy to discuss more.

reosarevok: Yeah, as you said, that doesn't search through aliases and doesn't do other normalising like ignoring "-"'s etc.

thanks!

I guess the main question is "is there a reason to deviate from that in theatre", which seems to be "not really since people mostly known as a duo will be credited as such"

:)

deviate from what?

Freso: I guess. I just find the search so irritating to use most of the time that I'm happy to deal with those downsides, unless I'm dealing with works in Japanese

CallerNo6: from just "credit who's credited"

oh, nm

got it

the question of "who do I credit when the cover simply says 'Cast of <foo>'?" would still need a theatre-specific guideline, I'd think.

Yeah, sure

And when nobody is credited

reosarevok: I've dealt with a few Russian works in the last couple of days... :)

trying to catalogue nightcore tracks is a bloody nightmare.

What's nigthcore?

nightcore is two separate but closely related things.

a norwegian electronic group that released some doublespeed trance music

and an associated youtube phenomenon by which heaps and heaps of other (usually electronic) music that is similarly sped up.

tbh, this will explain it better than I ever can: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/subcultures/night...

Heh. Listening to some now, surprisingly decent :)

not actually that bad.

just...really difficult to list properly on mb

since it's mostly distributed either in dubious compilations via filesharing/torrents, or as individual tracks that you'd have to download off of youtube.

Well, we do allow standalone recordings

standalone under the original artist (even when heavily remixed by unknown other artists with additional content?)

standalone under unknown artist (i hope not)?

standalone under Nightcore (may or not be the actual remixer)?

Oh, so other people are putting songs out there too and they're credited in the same way?

That's... tricky, yeah

right. there's no real differentiating between tracks by the original nightcore artist, and all of the music that has come later.

furthermore, the original Nightcore band isn't always interested in disavowing tracks that weren't originally remixed by them

and later anonymous remixers have further some tracks that were first remixed by the "original nightcore"

it seems like the best possible solution would be to catalog as many of the ersatz torrent compilations as possible, and add other tracks in some other way.

Going back to findability, it couldn't hurt to add a "Gilbert & Sullivan" alias to both G and S.

is it possible to have one artist credited multiple times in the same artist credit?

Yes

There's nothing blocking it anyway.

crazy people playing with themselves

I've used it a few times in cases where a classical composer performs/conducts his own compositions

^ crazy people

ahahahaa

you guys should have seen Melodifestivalen a couple of minutes ago

a guy was quite litterally playing with himself

that can be festive

i guess

is there a way to add a relation saying that a release by one artist is a remixed version of a release by another artist?

fiff: You can add that relationship between release groups.

Not releases.

ok

bad request: 400

should this release really have the same artist (for all tracks) and album artist http://musicbrainz.org/release/3b791aa7-9ea6-38... ?

It'd seem so, it's not like the tracklist gives anything better

the release is always listed as a tricky release

in collaboration with muggs and grease

Artist credits are whoever is credited, so what we have seems fine

e.g., it is part of tricky’s discography on wikipedia

Sure, it also is in MB though

it is not listed under “collaborations”, “other works” or similar