This is the week where our students have to submit their Final Evaluations. (Submission time started same time as meeting.) Hopefully all students are all set and all but ready to submit, but just in case you're not, mentors should be aware that there's a hard deadline coming, so please be available for your students!
2016-08-15 22826, 2016
Freso
(Mentors' final evaluations start next week, so I'll ping again then. ;))
2016-08-15 22802, 2016
Freso
So this is just a heads up. I'll keep an eye on submissions during during the week.
see this is what happens when we upgrade stuff. shoulda never gotten new logoes :P
2016-08-15 22838, 2016
Gentlecat
anyway, the ticket and PR are there
2016-08-15 22840, 2016
yvanz
If not perfect, these updated logos seem ready and are real improvement over previous ones. I am all for it.
2016-08-15 22848, 2016
Freso is indifferent towards monkey's vs. cat's logo texts
2016-08-15 22809, 2016
CatQuest
i approve of cat, out of principle
2016-08-15 22828, 2016
zas
New ones look better to me
2016-08-15 22831, 2016
CatQuest
but yes. i liek the newer ones
2016-08-15 22809, 2016
Freso
Seems like meeting agreement is for the newer ones. If you want more eyeballs on it, perhaps put it up on the forums?
2016-08-15 22821, 2016
CatQuest
👍
2016-08-15 22822, 2016
chirlu
What’s the process? Say again on the PR that the old text is ugly, typographically?
2016-08-15 22847, 2016
CatQuest
quirky doesnt have ot be ugly. so yea
2016-08-15 22826, 2016
reosarevok
Definitely the new ones
2016-08-15 22803, 2016
Freso
I think this topic is done. :) Comment on PR and Gentlecat or ruaok can open a topic on forums if they want non-IRC'ers to look at it too - otherwise agreement seems to favour Gentlecat's new ones by far.
First, thanks to people currently working on docker containers and hosting issues. I could not help with this, so I just started to work on a small subset of well delimited issues instead. I have been patching tiny bits of the URL Cleanup component of MusicBrainz Server for weeks. (There will always be such tiny issues for this component as external sites continuously change.) I would like to keep
2016-08-15 22842, 2016
yvanz
improving the code around as I get more used to this part. (Lengthy introduction done.) One of the stoppers is the lack of validation tests. http://tickets.musicbrainz.org/browse/MBS-6378 Is this development workflow appropriate so far? For this issue specifically, I proposed two ones: gradual migration or one go.
2016-08-15 22839, 2016
Freso
bitmap, Gentlecat ^
2016-08-15 22859, 2016
bitmap
sorry, reading the comment there
2016-08-15 22834, 2016
chirlu
Advantage of a flagday change: No duplication between old and new code.
2016-08-15 22800, 2016
chirlu
Disadvantage: Difficult to see in the history when a certain test was actually added/changed last.
2016-08-15 22844, 2016
bitmap
I'm fine with converting them all at once if you're willing to put in the work
2016-08-15 22816, 2016
bitmap
I guess we can't avoid losing history if the current structure is insufficient
2016-08-15 22815, 2016
yvanz
Maybe it is even more clear (for history) to have only one migration commit at one time, rather than many disparate ones over the time.
2016-08-15 22818, 2016
bitmap
though I haven't studied the suggestion closely...you may be more of an expert on this code than me at this point
2016-08-15 22838, 2016
yvanz
I would prefer the flagday change, if it is achievable in practice.
2016-08-15 22851, 2016
chirlu
I generally like the idea. The sketched data format may not be sufficient, though.
2016-08-15 22856, 2016
Freso looks up flagday change
2016-08-15 22802, 2016
yvanz
If I encounter too many special cases, I might go back to the other one.
2016-08-15 22804, 2016
CatQuest
i think they mean "in one go"
2016-08-15 22823, 2016
chirlu
Yes. Kernel speak, sorry.
2016-08-15 22834, 2016
CatQuest
ehe i guessed correctly :D
2016-08-15 22835, 2016
Freso
CatQuest: Yeah, that's my reading too. Just looking up where it comes from etc.
2016-08-15 22847, 2016
chirlu is reading too much LWN. ;-)
2016-08-15 22857, 2016
CatQuest
ir's close to 22 here for me, I'm to tired too :/
2016-08-15 22800, 2016
Freso wants to read more
2016-08-15 22802, 2016
CatQuest
is the meeting
2016-08-15 22808, 2016
Freso
Anyway.
2016-08-15 22815, 2016
yvanz
chirlu: the sketch is just a sketch, i already found issues in it. :)
2016-08-15 22817, 2016
Freso
yvanz: Did you get your answers?
2016-08-15 22827, 2016
yvanz
Freso: well, almost, yes.
2016-08-15 22836, 2016
CatQuest
!m yvanz
2016-08-15 22836, 2016
BrainzBot
You're doing good work, yvanz!
2016-08-15 22838, 2016
yvanz
Do I jump to the second point then?
2016-08-15 22842, 2016
Freso
Yes, please.
2016-08-15 22850, 2016
yvanz
There are many issues with URLs standardisation, on a regular basis. I took http://tickets.musicbrainz.org/browse/MBS-9044 as an example only, although we can also discuss this one now. Should it be discussed in STYLE beforehand? Could it be handled more systematically like recent ones (WP/Discogs): DB update with small batches?
Thanks chirlu :) WP's search wasn't being cooperative.
2016-08-15 22828, 2016
CatQuest
always chirlu with links 👍
2016-08-15 22847, 2016
yvanz
(If this is taking too long, we can just discuss the geo.itunes (linked issue) instead.)
2016-08-15 22828, 2016
Freso
yvanz: The last topic is not urgent. You have 10 more minutes. :)
2016-08-15 22804, 2016
reosarevok
yvanz: in general, I don't think cleanups need style approval
2016-08-15 22806, 2016
yvanz
Then we better have to discuss the more general standardisation issues handling problem.
2016-08-15 22826, 2016
reosarevok
Unless they involve outright blocking stuff from being linked, which I guess should be discussed
2016-08-15 22833, 2016
reosarevok
But if it just changes the URL, no problems IMO
2016-08-15 22800, 2016
bitmap
can't itunes releases in different regions have different tracklists?
2016-08-15 22834, 2016
Freso
I guess the main thing is the discussion about whether to execute clean-ups silently or by generating edits. And if the latter, do them all at once or in increments.
2016-08-15 22835, 2016
CatQuest
hmm
2016-08-15 22835, 2016
yvanz
If I am not wrong, digital releases on iTunes are considered worldwide releases.
2016-08-15 22855, 2016
Freso
yvanz: Not in MusicBrainz.
2016-08-15 22830, 2016
reosarevok
bitmap: probably not with the same ID, I'd expect?
2016-08-15 22844, 2016
Freso
(5 more minutes.)
2016-08-15 22815, 2016
bitmap
the last comment in the ticket said it may change the item id, which made me wonder
2016-08-15 22816, 2016
yvanz
Freso: ok, although the country release is a separate field. Changing the URL target doesn't hurt, I guess.
2016-08-15 22825, 2016
reosarevok
But not sure
2016-08-15 22848, 2016
Freso
Until we have more data, it's probably safer to not use the geo.itunes URLs.
2016-08-15 22809, 2016
reosarevok
yvanz: we generally consider the iTunes releases the same in multiple countries, it's just iTunes isn't really worldwide :)
2016-08-15 22814, 2016
bitmap
as for silent cleanups...we've only done that for really large changesets so far
2016-08-15 22836, 2016
Freso
I'm also a proponent for generating edits. :)
2016-08-15 22852, 2016
yvanz
there are 67K itunes urls in MB DB.
2016-08-15 22814, 2016
bitmap
okay, that's a lot
2016-08-15 22817, 2016
CatQuest
that's a lot of edits to add to the que
2016-08-15 22822, 2016
CatQuest
unless they're auto
2016-08-15 22826, 2016
Freso
CatQuest: They'd be autoedits.
2016-08-15 22829, 2016
CatQuest
ah
2016-08-15 22837, 2016
CatQuest
no issue then fro mme
2016-08-15 22846, 2016
bitmap
but not really bad compared to the wiki ones
2016-08-15 22847, 2016
CatQuest
from me, ark pressing enter instead of backward
2016-08-15 22854, 2016
Freso
But I don't think we'll want to convert iTunes links just yet.
2016-08-15 22807, 2016
chirlu
Yes, it seems to need more research first.
2016-08-15 22812, 2016
Freso
Let's get more data on how geo.itunes URLs first.
2016-08-15 22815, 2016
Freso
+behave
2016-08-15 22820, 2016
yvanz
To conclude with: no style ticket for URL-related issues, no change to geo.itunes (no standardisation to "no geo if it is already there" either?).
2016-08-15 22842, 2016
yvanz
Freso: we can go forth and back with this "geo." prefix change.
2016-08-15 22845, 2016
Freso
yvanz: I think that's about right, yeah.
2016-08-15 22809, 2016
bitmap
well, I wouldn't add any special handling wrt geo links until we know what we're doing with them
2016-08-15 22825, 2016
Freso
yvanz: Let's get more research done (e.g., on albums changing id) and then we can make a decision for geo.itunes or not-geo.itunes.
2016-08-15 22832, 2016
Freso
What bitmap said. :)
2016-08-15 22842, 2016
CatQuest
to geo or not to geo, that is the question
2016-08-15 22858, 2016
Freso
yvanz: Good enough for now?
2016-08-15 22800, 2016
yvanz
As for the silent cleanup of existing URLs? Still a per case thing?
2016-08-15 22806, 2016
Freso
Yeah.
2016-08-15 22812, 2016
yvanz
Freso: yes, thanks.
2016-08-15 22826, 2016
Freso
We've discussed such cases at the meeting previously.
2016-08-15 22838, 2016
Freso
Arguing about whether to deal with them one way or another.
2016-08-15 22801, 2016
Freso
So I'd say bringing individual cases here is the way to go.
2016-08-15 22814, 2016
Freso
Or at least make an MBS ticket about them.
2016-08-15 22814, 2016
yvanz
Ultimately, I think it should be done programmatically, but it is really not a priority right now.
2016-08-15 22816, 2016
Freso
Anyway.
2016-08-15 22821, 2016
Freso
It's 1 minute past.
2016-08-15 22824, 2016
Freso
Thanks for your time!
2016-08-15 22829, 2016
Freso
</BANG>
2016-08-15 22855, 2016
TOPIC: MetaBrainz Community and Development channel | MusicBrainz non-development: #musicbrainz | MeB meeting agenda: Reviews, GSoC Final Evaluations!! (Freso), splitting Discourse's MB category (Freso)
