#musicbrainz

well,

I guess I was wondering if you sought out the Echo Nest folks because they were interested in open-sourcing their code base, or if you'd be equally happy with another service as long as the licensing was workable

I'm happy with the idea that any entity I contribute fingerprints to will not suddenly take their ball and go home..

the echonest realized that by open sourceing their stuff they would get much more reach and should be able to build a commodity fingerprint system.

(as a random user of mb)

so who got in touch with who first?

and I've been looking for open solutions for fingerprinting for many years now.

n8willis: hard to say. we have an ongoing relationship with the echonest.

this wasn't our first dealings. see project rosetta stone.

and Paul Lamere of EN used to work for Sun, and Sun donated hardware to us before.

so it's more of a "mutual good fit" scenario?

so this is a continuation of previous relationships.

k

yes, a good way to say that.

plus EN donated $2k to our hardware fundraiser.

free as in beer

derwin?

> And if there is, does Echoprint offer any patent protection for users of its open source software?

when I mentioned patents, they said they were looking into that.

ok

its best to ask them about patents. :)

yeah ... I promise I'm trying ...

n8willis: I was being slightly jokey about the oft-repeated "free as in speech" vs "free as in beer" dichotomy

n8willis: I was alluding to the idea that $2k was "free as in beer" :)

ah

"free as in fundraiser"....

exactly :)

I'm just the peanut gallery, sorry :)

so what's going on with acoustid?

luks: you wanna answer that?

luks is the author of that.

oh, cool

but, MB's view is to try and be fingerprint tech agnostic -- as far as that is possible.

(when I asked last night, he suggested that they are complimentary and slightly different in design and implementation)

someone on the LWN announcement story ( http://lwn.net/Articles/448960/ ) thought they had different scope

(I probably still have it in scrollback if he's idle, as I shouldn't speak for him)

we can now say that we will only have open solutions supported in MB

ok

and thus, let the best tech win.

and the best tech will be the tech that embraces its users and works to improve the service.

last question (promise!) -- the blog says you're testing echoprint on its own server. how's that been going, and have you learned anything yet? like, performance-wise?

"what's going on with acoustid" is a hard question to answer :)

n8willis: we're not actually testing their server. we have support for echoprints in our test server echoprint.musicbrainz.org

right; I meant your own, not their own....

(as in, not the main MB server)

well, thats just copy&pasta from the PUID code, so there isn't much to learn there.

I feel that the echoprint stuff is still very raw and that quite a bit of tuning needs to happen before its really ready for use.

My rule of thumb is that it will be at least a year from the time the authors say their service is done to when its actually done.

could be 2 years.

I think luks is going to be different there. he'll spend 2 years hacking on it and never calling it done. :)

I'll call it done when it's done, I always do that :)

but it will likely work better and be more stable than anyone else's fingerprints.

luks: yep, your standards of done are different for most everyone. :)

so it's a long ways before we'll see either one fully integrated, then

its not about integration, as much as it is about critical mass.

not sure I follow you there

you wont get critical mass until you convince app authors to include the tech into their apps.

"adoption"

and then you need to build a pile of clean data for everyone to clearly see the value.

once you have both of those, you'll see a good adoption.

right; but so I understand what MB is doing -- you don't have to add new Track parameters to support either fingerprinting service?

that's where rosetta stone comes in?

we have to add new tables for the echoprint stuff, but not for acoustid.

acoustid manages the mapping to MB on its own turf.

acoustid integrated with musicbrainz, not the other way around

whereas MB manages it for echoprints.

I'd still like to know what those "echoprints" are though :)

you should answer that mb-devel email, I don't think anybody from the echo nest will

hello peoples

luks: I've tried to understand it, but I don't. I'll keep pestering alastairp to answer it.

hi Yllona

ruaok: well, it will be your decision at the end

(what they "are" ?)

ruaok! what's up luv?

luks: agreed, but I need to understand first. :)

but if MB is going to track the echo nest song IDs, it has nothing to do with echoprints, so it woud be a mistake to call it like that

Yllona: same shit, different turn around the globe. you?

ruaok: same old, new fabulous digs. did you get my new postal addy?

yup

coolness

I'm finally settled in, anything i can help with?

can you answer my pile of emails?

I never seem to get on top of it. :(

I'm willing:) You need an admin asst?

heh. that would be nice. but I'd rather have more engineers. :)

I hear you. I have time for drudgery tasks. Just send them my way...

ready... set... http://tickets.musicbrainz.org ;)

ianmcorvidae: my musicbrainz credentials didn't work. am i doing something wrong?

also, dammit: the first time I have a real use for my bach-werke-verzeichnis it's on the other side of the country D:

Yllona: you need a new account

everything has its own account at the moment

ianmcorvidae: oky,doky. thx

see also http://tickets.musicbrainz.org/browse/OTHER-16 :P

I seem to remember that someone here was working on some CD ripping scripts for linux; anyone remember what the name of it was?

ianmcorvidae: I'm in! thank you. i'll explore

bitmap: The daily build now work right with CD-Lookup

HeinzBoettjer: that's good, thanks for testing it :)

At the moment the program look like no funktion except view the data. Or have I to change some config to add data for a new CD?

HeinzBoettjer: you mean add a new CD to musicbrainz? you can only add new data through the musicbrainz.org website

CD Rip is not possible. What is the main funktion of the program?

you can't rip CDs with Picard, no. it's only for tagging your music files with metadata from MusicBrainz

ah ok, rip offline with any program and then sync

yes

can i told sound juicer not to look into the MusicBrainz database?

I've never used sound juicer, maybe someone else might know

HeinzBoettjer: I don’t think so.

HeinzBoettjer: (Why would you want to?)

because of an existing doppel cd which is wrong imported since the new version

doppel=double

Indeed

How is it imported wrong? Because sound-juicer only sees the first disc?

Anyway, you can still key it in manually, which is the same as you’d have to do if you did get S-J to stop doing MB lookups

no he report both discs for any of the discs

I just make a example snapshot, just a moment

Does SoundJuicer use libmusicbrainz?

i ask the software center, please wait

hrm

I have this label where the artists were not printed on the original but are on the repress :

adhawkins: yes, it does

how should this be handled in musicbrainz?

I don't understand the problem

adhawkins: yes he use it. Version >=3.0.2

Sounds like SoundJuicer will need to update to v4 once I release it.

Just waiting on luks to check some code in ;)

hi

oh uh

is it normal two tracks with the same title (but a different album) have the same uid?

I guess if they'r ethe same 'work' then yes.

do you have an example?

"Soliloquy of Chaos" from "Gang Starr" is such an example

the title and artists is the same, but the album and track number is different

it's because i use amarok as player and it uses the uid as identifier for each track, so there are a lot of tracks i don't see :s

presumably http://musicbrainz.org/recording/6ebc8db4-db40-...

rip guru

I guess you have more than one of those releases