I don’t have Beyonce in my playlist, but I have other artists, that do different stuff with different aliases, and I could still find/sort them with real name
2013-05-29 14909, 2013
reosarevok
SultS: isn't that a legal-name-alias issue though?
2013-05-29 14920, 2013
SultS
simukis_: what about it?
2013-05-29 14932, 2013
hawke_1
I also *really* don’t know why the main name wouldn’t even be her current name…
2013-05-29 14950, 2013
simukis_
SultS: still no reconsideration?
2013-05-29 14945, 2013
SultS
reosarevok: you can’t have have an artist alias in your tags as performer/producer/etc, afaik
2013-05-29 14953, 2013
SultS
simukis_: I haven’t gotten to it yet
2013-05-29 14930, 2013
simukis_
SultS: Ok. If you'll be interested, I can provide you with the tracks as well as the merged-aligned version 😊
2013-05-29 14951, 2013
SultS
simukis_: oh, digital copies usually are unmixed… have you checked track durations?
2013-05-29 14930, 2013
reosarevok
SultS: and you can have the legal name rel? If that's the case, please enter a ticket to allow the legal name alias
2013-05-29 14935, 2013
simukis_
yup, they match.
2013-05-29 14922, 2013
reosarevok
hawke_1: I really don't want to go around having to clean up every single place where editors use the full name because they are lazy / don't understand credits :/
2013-05-29 14908, 2013
hawke_1
reosarevok: sure, but isn’t that a point in favor of “Beyoncé”?
2013-05-29 14936, 2013
reosarevok
hawke_1: sure, I thought "current name" in your comment was "Beyoncé Knowles-Carter"
2013-05-29 14939, 2013
simukis_
only it's more like 0:05:35.255 here rather than 0:05:34.
2013-05-29 14953, 2013
SultS
reosarevok: if I have performance and legal name artists, I can use credits for performance name and link actual performance to the legal name… and those will go both to tags…
2013-05-29 14914, 2013
hawke_1
reosarevok: Between: Beyoncé / Beyoncé Knowles / Beyoncé Knowles-Carter, isn’t “Beyoncé Knowles” (which that edit suggests) the worst of all worlds?
2013-05-29 14950, 2013
SultS
simukis_: that sounds to me like you have the unmixed release
2013-05-29 14938, 2013
SultS
simukis_: it is very common with edm music, that CD version is mixed, and downloadable releases are unmixed tracks + single mixed track (containing the mix that’s on cd)
2013-05-29 14904, 2013
hawke_1
reosarevok: So my preference is: actual performing name (Beyoncé), Current “real” name (Beyoncé Knowles-Carter); former name/occasional credited name in liner notes (Beyoncé Knowles)
2013-05-29 14954, 2013
KRSCuan
SultS: That message shouldn't have been there anyway.
maybe you can hear the end of Sombrero at the beginning of track 21? :)
2013-05-29 14947, 2013
fractalizator joined the channel
2013-05-29 14956, 2013
SultS
but that’s how it usually is with chillout mixes
2013-05-29 14911, 2013
SultS
it’s often one fading out, other fading in
2013-05-29 14904, 2013
KRSCuan
<reosarevok> (for cases with only one performance name, both seem to be equally valid) ← I could argue that Sasha Fierce should be added as a performance name, so we need Beyoncé and Beyoncé Knowles as separate artists too! :p
2013-05-29 14911, 2013
simukis_
SultS: Hmm, the beginning of track 21 doesn't have anything of the sombrero's ending. But well, Sombrero's ending is also really quiet.
2013-05-29 14955, 2013
SultS
:D maybe listening to the whole release helps then :P
2013-05-29 14941, 2013
SultS
but I do think it’s the case of simultaneous fade out - fade in
most of those changes won't be visible from any tool anyway?
2013-05-29 14902, 2013
Kovensky
they will
2013-05-29 14917, 2013
Kovensky
composer/lyricist tags, if you enable relationship tags in Picard
2013-05-29 14906, 2013
simukis_
SultS: Actually it doesn't sound like a crossfade at all now that I've stiched them up. 19-20 transitions quite beautifully so you could even think they crossfade… but it is not a case with 20-21 transition which is abrupt.
2013-05-29 14946, 2013
Vorpal joined the channel
2013-05-29 14918, 2013
Kovensky
but mostly I want to see the final result in the web interface
2013-05-29 14925, 2013
Kovensky
and how it affects relationship add searches
2013-05-29 14937, 2013
simukis_
you can hear some 21st in the end of 20th, but not 20th in 21st.
2013-05-29 14944, 2013
reosarevok
Kovensky: those are shown on the web interface while pending
2013-05-29 14952, 2013
reosarevok
(ok, not the removals)
2013-05-29 14903, 2013
reosarevok isn't sure how this music works, but are you sure based on is right?
2013-05-29 14913, 2013
simukis_
Oh well, I'll just cancel this one… too much of pain to merge it and it's not like I care that much 😃
2013-05-29 14914, 2013
reosarevok
Does it take only the basic melodies and rewrite the rest?
2013-05-29 14920, 2013
Kovensky
reosarevok: pretty much
2013-05-29 14925, 2013
Kovensky
the structure is different, it only shares some motifs
2013-05-29 14941, 2013
Kovensky
e.g. the singer follows the original song's melody, but the instruments are completely different, etc
2013-05-29 14913, 2013
Kovensky
or the melody is only followed in the chorus, while the rest of the song is completely different, things like that
2013-05-29 14938, 2013
reosarevok
ok, that does sound like a reasonable use of based on then I guess
2013-05-29 14950, 2013
reosarevok is just not used to see it used outside classical
2013-05-29 14909, 2013
Kovensky
yeah, the doujin community is weird since it encourages derivative works
2013-05-29 14937, 2013
Kovensky
while modern mainstream music avoids that because of copyright issues
2013-05-29 14955, 2013
kepstin-work
hmm, you're doing stuff on alstroemeria records, eh :)
2013-05-29 14911, 2013
kepstin-work put a lot of work into getting that to the state where it is, but never completely finished cleaning them up
2013-05-29 14914, 2013
Kovensky
(doujin music *is* a gray area, but some composers such as ZUN (of Touhou) gives license for doujin people to use his works)
2013-05-29 14937, 2013
kepstin-work
ZUN's wording on that is basically the same as CC-BY-NC
2013-05-29 14948, 2013
Kovensky
no, you can use it commercially
2013-05-29 14954, 2013
Kovensky
as long as you sell on doujin events
2013-05-29 14915, 2013
Kovensky
he doesn't like digital distribution at all though
2013-05-29 14927, 2013
kepstin-work
eastnewsound has released stuff on itunes, but they've only released their original works there :)
2013-05-29 14900, 2013
SultS
simukis_: but how does it *look* like? looking at the waveform here the ending of the track is certainly abrupt… also I wouldn’t merge recordings, if I had some suspicion one of them was part of a mix
2013-05-29 14905, 2013
fractalizator
guyz!
2013-05-29 14922, 2013
Kovensky
<Kovensky> (doujin music *is* a gray area <-- correction: non-original doujin music
2013-05-29 14926, 2013
fractalizator
can I get your votes before I proceed with the merge?
<simukis_> you can hear some 21st in the end of 20th, but not 20th in 21st. → that would certainly make it mixed and a different recording
2013-05-29 14956, 2013
Kovensky
kepstin-work: yeah, "based on" is a more specific version of "later version of"
2013-05-29 14911, 2013
kepstin-work
the wording for the 'based on' ar is a bit strange, tho
2013-05-29 14933, 2013
Kovensky
and "later version of" to me means that ZUN's composition is a "previous version of" ._.
2013-05-29 14939, 2013
kepstin-work
"The new work must be a new composition, not just an arrangement or the same music with different or translated lyrics. "
2013-05-29 14940, 2013
Kovensky
while they're not revisions of the same base work
2013-05-29 14901, 2013
kepstin-work
while for the touhou arrange works, there is typically no (credited) additional composition
2013-05-29 14909, 2013
kepstin-work
so by that, 'based on' doesn't fit
2013-05-29 14931, 2013
simukis_
such a distinction of recording might make it so ALL recordings become seperate, because it's too hard to validate them being not mix…
2013-05-29 14949, 2013
Kovensky
kepstin-work: there's also the "has arrangement" relation
2013-05-29 14908, 2013
Kovensky
but "is the basis for" fits it best IMO
2013-05-29 14920, 2013
SultS
simukis_: not really… releasy type already gives a pretty good idea :) and the ones you are relatively safe to merge, usually have both the same name and duration
2013-05-29 14928, 2013
SultS
release*
2013-05-29 14937, 2013
kepstin-work
yeah; I wonder if we should just put a proposal through to change the wording in the 'is the basis for' relationship
2013-05-29 14953, 2013
kepstin-work
I think it was meant specifically to exclude stuff like hip-hop beats.
2013-05-29 14947, 2013
Kovensky
<<random hip-hop song>> "is based on" "Amen, Brother" by "The Winstons"
2013-05-29 14903, 2013
Kovensky runs
2013-05-29 14922, 2013
kepstin-work
well, by "beat" I mean a complete backing track which is used as-is on multiple vocal tracks, with different lyrics.
2013-05-29 14931, 2013
derwin
Kovensky: I actually started adding "contains samples of" for "Amen, Brother" and "Can You Feel It" by Mr. Fingers
2013-05-29 14909, 2013
derwin
Kovensky: presumably each of them could have tens of thousands of such relationships..
2013-05-29 14925, 2013
jcazevedo joined the channel
2013-05-29 14925, 2013
fractalizator
am I invisible? :(
2013-05-29 14937, 2013
kepstin-work notes that http://musicbrainz.org/artist/c7803db2-dbf0-4626-ae7c-8c8937789fcc is his favourite non-touhou original music doujin group
2013-05-29 14942, 2013
Kovensky
kepstin-work: I see
2013-05-29 14944, 2013
kepstin-work
"group" is iffy tho, since it's only one person ;)
2013-05-29 14951, 2013
Kovensky
:)
2013-05-29 14900, 2013
Kovensky
there's no better category than "group" in MB though <_<
2013-05-29 14903, 2013
kepstin-work
yeah :/
2013-05-29 14915, 2013
derwin
btw, there may be levels of nerd-dom.. 1) plays touhou 2) listens to touhou music 3) listens to touhou doujin music 4) enters touhou doujin music into mb 5) has an opinion on style of touhou doujin music on mb
2013-05-29 14930, 2013
derwin
fractalizator: sec\
2013-05-29 14949, 2013
kepstin-work
derwin: there are issues with that. I am 2,3,4,5 but not 1 ;)
kepstin-work sucks at shmups in general and touhou in particular.
2013-05-29 14920, 2013
derwin
kepstin-work: LOL, I am 1,2 but not 3-5 :)
2013-05-29 14922, 2013
Kovensky
<kepstin-work> well, by "beat" I mean a complete backing track which is used as-is on multiple vocal tracks, with different lyrics. <-- one of my dad's coworkers used to, like 10 years ago, take very old instrumental reggae recordings and record his own singing on top of it
2013-05-29 14924, 2013
simukis_
I'm a 2, 3 and 4, but not 5 or 1 😃
2013-05-29 14941, 2013
derwin recently installed raiden legacy, likes shmups generally :)
2013-05-29 14943, 2013
Kovensky
that's one perfect example for what wouldn't qualify for the "based on" relationship
2013-05-29 14907, 2013
Kovensky
he'd send it to local reggae radios for playback
2013-05-29 14949, 2013
Kovensky
if those were added to musicbrainz my 12yo self would be credited with (additional? he *was* supervising / teaching me) mastering (lol)
2013-05-29 14956, 2013
kepstin-work
but yeah; many of these touhou "arrange" songs are really new compositions based on zun's music, just without the additional composition credited :/
