#musicbrainz

the last part is still a little hazy, but I'm sure I'll figure it out.

Sounds right to me.

Hmm, where a poem was set to music, and the music itself also has a title but was written specifically for the poem, what if any relations should there be between the music work, and the music+poem work?

I’m inclined to say music+poem “is a later version of” music

but the music didn’t exist prior to the combination of the two.

hawke__: you mean "words of advice for young people" or um.. "into the void" covered by soundgarden

hawke__: " For its cover of Black Sabbath's "Into the Void", the original lyrics are replaced by words of protest by Chief Sealth, which fit the meter of the song.[15] At the 1993 Grammy Awards, "Into the Void (Sealth)" received a nomination for Best Metal Performance. "

That’s kind of the other way round, isn’t it? same music, new lyrics?

but yeah, similar situation.

Though in that case the music and the lyrics both clearly existed before

I think I’ll just continue to treat “later version of” as if it was a backwards “based on” since that makes more sense. :-)

all releases are poettry set to music

music composed for the poetry

Spinvis is a musician, Vinkenoog the poet.

hawke_: btw, I was thinking about how to link derived versions the other day

hawke_: I eventually came to the conclusion that I'd need four options, to say that the lyrics are the same, the music is the same, the lyrics are based on the original or the music is based on the original (which of course could be combined :P)

and that was about as far as I got with the idea :P

It’s usually pretty clear since the composer and lyricist would be the same as the previous version

but that doesn't prove anything :/

like http://musicbrainz.org/work/ae03bd78-312d-3e93-... and http://musicbrainz.org/work/beac976b-c42d-33bc-...

You mean in that the composer could have composed something new based on the older one, and so the music is different even though the composer is the same?

yeah

or the same person could have written new lyrics

or the same person could have just modified the original lyrics

True enough.

But I think for most purposes you don’t need all that. :-)

If it’s a new version, it doesn’t matter whether the lyrics or music are exactly the same or not

it just seems weird to me to lump everything together

and nobody's forced to link works together if they don't want to either

where would i find info about current musicbrainz api's ?

nikki++

nikki: do you know of any currently existing library in PHP that will talk to the musicbrainz xml web service?

nope, sorry

nikki: in any other languages? All i see on the wiki is an example in python

are these questions more appropriate for this channel, or #musicbrainz-devel ? wasn't quite sure

dukeleto: I have no idea on the state of this: https://launchpad.net/phpmusicbrainz

probably #musicbrainz-devel :)

the same people usually hang out in both though

and I only know of people working on c and python stuff

ruaok: interesting! i am looking to see if I can reuse something already written to interface with cashmusic, or if I need to write a mb library in PHP first :)

ruaok: that lib looks like it still uses the old version of the mb api

yeah.

ruaok: are you planning on adding read/write to the xml api, or creating a different api for that?

best to go with v2 if at all possible

into the v2 api.

we'll support PUT/POST operations on the same resources

ruaok: awesome! resty deliciousness

ooh, i see there is some musicbrainz activity on github

ruaok: how different are v1 and v2 of the api?

ruaok: would it be better to write from scratch, or modify code from v1 to v2 ?

modify I would think.

the data structures change quite a bit, but it might still be less effort than going from scratch

to translate or not to translate….

original Norwegian track listing "Crying (lang version)" or english "Crying (long version)

"

i assume there is already a cpan module for talking to v2 of the api?

the track titles are generally in English, except for these qualifiers.

MJ: “Crying”, with the disambiguation as “long version”?

yeah, except the track listing names it (Lang Versjon) (mistyped that earlier).

Ah.

oh, fun, other qualifiers in that same listing:

I’d put the tracklisting as “Crying (Lang Versjon)”, and then the recording as “Crying” with a disambiguation of “Long Version” (Assuming there’s also a short version ;-) )

"Bogus Bonus", "Interlude", "Introlude", "Prins Thomas Diskomiks" and "Rough Multitrack Edit"

there is a short version on disc 1.

btw, (Lang Versjon) and not (lang versjon)?

next fun detail

the original LP from 1979 had some tracks which were deemed one, but consisted of 2 or 3 parts.

so "Joy, Parts I & 2", and "Man of the Present Age, Parts I-III"

so those are one recording.

(each).

but now the CD remastering split those over separate tracks.

should I point to the original recording for these still?

or are these new recordings?

new recordings.

thanks

ugh, along the way MB lost my DiscID that I was basing this on.

oh well, I'll reattach.

ugh, the Relate to… box is useless for recordings

unless you can add artist:"" and other qualifiers..

hawke__: so, I edit this recording (http://musicbrainz.org/recording/fb137d02-0f55-...) to replace (lang versjon) with (long version), right?

MJ: relate to is OK, but it requires that the search index be updated before it works properly. That happens every 3? 6? hours.

Well, that’s what I would do, yes. My opinion is not gospel though

k

I'm leaving the titles as is; all the bonus CD tracks are remixes.

hawke_: 3 hours

Should a release which is credited differently in different countries be entered in separate release groups?

I recently merged all the Roger the Engineer releases into one group

There are at least 3 different titles that came out as.

I enter them in the same release group if they're the same release

depending on region and how much the "Roger the Engineer" nick-name was sticking.

define “the same release”?

well, same criteria I would use if it hadn't had a different name :P

same basic set of tracks, perhaps reordered a bit, possibly bonus tracks/discs

Same name of the release (It’s untitled, a single), same tracks. It’s the credits that are different

making it problematic to put credits on the RG, you see.

how different?

“Django Reinhardt et le Quintette du Hot-Club de France avec Arthur Briggs et Stéphane Grappelli” in some places, “Stéphane Grappelly and his Hot Four” in others, “Hot Club of France Quintet” in others.

Along with several variants of “Quintet of the Hot Club of France” but those are fine since it’s at least the same artist.

So “Stéphane Grappelly and his Hot Four” is the problematic one, really.

Maybe I should merge that into the “QHCF” artist

It seems to be used pretty much exclusively for releases by the group

How often are empty artists auto-removed?

shortly after midnight UTC

daily

So why is http://musicbrainz.org/artist/074511e7-8415-414... still there? ;-)

did it go empty just today?

yesterday

and modbot waits 24 hours

I show two days ago.

just under 2

Well, 2 midnights passed anyway

how so?

I see Closed: 2011-11-03 03:00 UTC

current time is 22:17 utc on the 4th

Ah, I see Closed: 2011-11-02 22:00:04 CDT

So it’s midnight UTC?

that's what ruaok said :P

So he did.

D’oh.

yep.

[17:08] dswoeif musicbrainz.org was a suburb there would be a lot of tea abusers

wtf?

I wondered about that myself.