Le nozze di Figaro, K. 492: Act I, Scene I. Recitativo "Cosa stai misurando" (Figaro, Susanna)
2008-02-01 03208, 2008
brianfreud
we could even drop the quotes, and do
2008-02-01 03214, 2008
brianfreud
Symphony No. 41 in C major, Jupiter, K. 551: I. Allegro vivace
2008-02-01 03227, 2008
cooperaa
What about Cantatas: Cantata, BWV 100 "The cantata name": I. Aria (soprano) "the words"
2008-02-01 03252, 2008
xlotlu
cooperaa: from a DB pov, it's wrong to type in Op. 30 for all the sonatas in it
2008-02-01 03201, 2008
brianfreud
Cantata on the Holy Grave of Christ for Soloists, Choir & Orchestra in C major “Grabmusik”, K. 35a/42: VI. Duetto "Jesu, was hab ich getan?" (Der Engel, Die Seele)
2008-02-01 03204, 2008
brianfreud
instead of Cantata on the Holy Grave of Christ for Soloists, Choir & Orchestra in C major, K. 35a/42 "Grabmusik": VI. Duetto "Jesu, was hab ich getan?" (Der Engel, Die Seele) ?
2008-02-01 03228, 2008
brianfreud
xlotlu: I disagree - “Op. 30” is the Beethoven equiv of K. 532
2008-02-01 03222, 2008
xlotlu
what's 532?
2008-02-01 03238, 2008
brianfreud
sorry, K. 536 - 12 German Dances
2008-02-01 03225, 2008
xlotlu
brianfreud: well, it's just as wrong to type in "K. 536" for each dance
2008-02-01 03230, 2008
brianfreud
cooperaa: We’ve always said opera style is a subset of CSG... I’m just looking for a way to make it really a subset, which means making both fit the same pattern, which they currently don’t, in just that one issue
2008-02-01 03255, 2008
brianfreud
xlotlu: no it’s not. K. 536 is the Kochel # for each dance. There just happen to be 12 dances ID’d as K. 536.
2008-02-01 03230, 2008
xlotlu
ID'd! good choice
2008-02-01 03233, 2008
brianfreud
Don’t try to think like “catalog number == 1 work, and only one work”, because that’s not how it works
2008-02-01 03247, 2008
xlotlu
you can't have more works with the same ID
2008-02-01 03254, 2008
brianfreud
yes, you can
2008-02-01 03200, 2008
cooperaa_ joined the channel
2008-02-01 03202, 2008
Amblin- has quit
2008-02-01 03203, 2008
xlotlu
DB talk here, mkay
2008-02-01 03213, 2008
brianfreud
K. 536 ID’s 12 different works. (Plus, if you add in the Zu XXX works, potentially even more than 12)
brianfreud was rather annoyed when he discovered the existance of Zu works... :P
2008-02-01 03256, 2008
xlotlu
exactly. K536 is something else; and it's not something that should be typed in like the common name, but a field by itself
2008-02-01 03220, 2008
xlotlu
like in... "parent id"
2008-02-01 03231, 2008
xlotlu
where the parent is the damn opus
2008-02-01 03236, 2008
cooperaa_
ok
2008-02-01 03237, 2008
brianfreud
well, that’s why I broke that “Catalog_Number” structure CSG has into “Catalog Number” and “Opus Number”
2008-02-01 03213, 2008
brianfreud
Cat # ID’s the collection within the whole. Opus # ID’s the work within the collection.
2008-02-01 03229, 2008
brianfreud
then movement # ID’s the work within the Opus #
2008-02-01 03200, 2008
brianfreud
(then the a, b, c, etc ID’s the submovement within the movement #)
2008-02-01 03228, 2008
brianfreud
(and cooperaa’s -i, -ii, -iii ID’s the sub-submovement within the submovement)
2008-02-01 03229, 2008
xlotlu
you're forgetting beethoven: Opus 30 -- 3 sonatas
2008-02-01 03200, 2008
brianfreud
“Opus #” could perhaps be better named “Sub-Collection #”
2008-02-01 03201, 2008
xlotlu
and some sort of Cat. no would be Sonata No. 7
2008-02-01 03215, 2008
cooperaa_
I'm confident that brianfreud has thought this through thoroughly (probably more than anyone else)
2008-02-01 03222, 2008
brianfreud
yes, but remember, we’re dealing with catalog structures from the 18th century...
2008-02-01 03237, 2008
cooperaa_
I'm going to hit the hay
2008-02-01 03240, 2008
MrQwerty has quit
2008-02-01 03243, 2008
cooperaa_
got get up for work tomorrow
2008-02-01 03243, 2008
brianfreud just wishes he could do the cat #’s without bothering what some dude in 1788 decided to do :P
2008-02-01 03247, 2008
brianfreud
natta cooperaa
2008-02-01 03254, 2008
xlotlu
'night
2008-02-01 03258, 2008
cooperaa_
good luck sorting this out :)
2008-02-01 03259, 2008
cooperaa_
later
2008-02-01 03200, 2008
MrQwerty joined the channel
2008-02-01 03218, 2008
xlotlu
brianfreud: we should screw them all (including kochel), and make a MB catalogue
2008-02-01 03225, 2008
xlotlu
MBMoz 1
2008-02-01 03227, 2008
cooperaa_
hehehe :)
2008-02-01 03237, 2008
cooperaa_
shot not doing the research
2008-02-01 03244, 2008
brianfreud
sure... if you really want to make the entire style list go apeshit on you, go ahead and propose it...
2008-02-01 03248, 2008
xlotlu
impose that as international standard and take over the world :P
2008-02-01 03251, 2008
brianfreud is still hiding from em-dash
2008-02-01 03256, 2008
cooperaa_
——————
2008-02-01 03202, 2008
cooperaa_
……………
2008-02-01 03205, 2008
cooperaa_
I like it
2008-02-01 03217, 2008
cooperaa_
I can't wait 'til I can go edit "...and Justice for All" :)
2008-02-01 03225, 2008
brianfreud
cooperaa: before you go...
2008-02-01 03240, 2008
brianfreud
one quickie thing a wikipedia styleguide comment made me think of...
2008-02-01 03223, 2008
brianfreud
if we did use emdash for tempos, we could drop the spaces: Allego—andante—primo tempo
2008-02-01 03236, 2008
brianfreud
4 characters shorter than Allegro - andante - primo tempo
2008-02-01 03247, 2008
cooperaa_
cool
2008-02-01 03255, 2008
cooperaa_
I'm not too worried about that
2008-02-01 03258, 2008
brianfreud is rather aware of the 255 char limit
2008-02-01 03200, 2008
brianfreud
lol
2008-02-01 03203, 2008
cooperaa_
:)
2008-02-01 03206, 2008
brianfreud
I run into it too often :P
2008-02-01 03227, 2008
cooperaa_
I've run into that on Beethoven's Ninth: IV :)
2008-02-01 03230, 2008
cooperaa_
that's it so far
2008-02-01 03242, 2008
brianfreud
is that the psycho one you have all the () in?
2008-02-01 03251, 2008
cooperaa_
probably
2008-02-01 03258, 2008
brianfreud
125 movement 4, iirc
2008-02-01 03204, 2008
cooperaa_
yup
2008-02-01 03209, 2008
cooperaa_
Symphony No. 9 in D minor, Op. 125 "Choral": IV. Recitative. (Presto - Allegro ma non troppo - Vivace - Adagio cantabile - Allegro assai - Presto "O Freunde") - Allegro assai "Freude, schöner Götterfunken" - Alla marcia - Allegro assai vivace "Froh, wie seine Sonnen" - Andante maestoso "Seid umschlungen, Millionen!" - Adagio ma non troppo, ma divoto "Ihr, stürzt nieder" - Allegro energico, sempre ben marcato ("Freude, s
2008-02-01 03220, 2008
brianfreud
yeah, not a clue how I would do that mess
2008-02-01 03233, 2008
brianfreud
but you have that same “sleigh ride” submovement’s with titles problem I ran in to
2008-02-01 03235, 2008
cooperaa_
brackets are needed to show what is a subsection of what
2008-02-01 03204, 2008
brianfreud
at a certain point, any of this becomes textual vomit :P
2008-02-01 03211, 2008
cooperaa_
yup
2008-02-01 03215, 2008
cooperaa_
I edited my local file...
2008-02-01 03241, 2008
cooperaa_
still pretty disasterous:
2008-02-01 03242, 2008
cooperaa_
Symphony No. 9 in D minor, Op. 125 "Choral": IVb. Presto) - Allegro assai - Alla marcia - Allegro assai vivace - Andante maestoso - Adagio ma non troppo, ma divoto - Allegro energico, sempre ben marcato - Allegro ma non tanto - Prestissimo
2008-02-01 03208, 2008
cooperaa_
Should really just be something like IVb. Presto
2008-02-01 03209, 2008
MrQwerty` has quit
2008-02-01 03242, 2008
brianfreud
wait...
2008-02-01 03252, 2008
brianfreud
if I read that right, you have sub-submovements with titles?
2008-02-01 03209, 2008
brianfreud
Allegro assai vivace "Froh, wie seine Sonnen", etc?
2008-02-01 03217, 2008
cooperaa_
yes
2008-02-01 03222, 2008
cooperaa_
those are the vocal parts
2008-02-01 03226, 2008
brianfreud
holy christ Beethoven....
2008-02-01 03252, 2008
cooperaa_
the damn movement is 23 minutes long...
2008-02-01 03254, 2008
brianfreud
I thought 3 German Dances for Orchestra in C major, K. 605 No. 3: German Dance & Trio "Die Schlittenfahrt" & Coda was going too far, but that’s just insane
2008-02-01 03213, 2008
cooperaa_
it could be split into 5 sub-movements
2008-02-01 03225, 2008
brianfreud
Why not do that?
2008-02-01 03244, 2008
cooperaa_
because on CDs it is usually 1 or 2 tracks split right before the vocal entrance
2008-02-01 03205, 2008
brianfreud
true.... I’ve seen it live, and it is one insane movement
2008-02-01 03218, 2008
cooperaa has quit
2008-02-01 03224, 2008
cooperaa_
cool, I haven't had the pleasure yet... one day for sure though!
2008-02-01 03228, 2008
brianfreud notes that B’s 9th has caused him a breakup in the past :P
2008-02-01 03235, 2008
cooperaa_
lol
2008-02-01 03201, 2008
cooperaa_
she didn't like it and you told her she wasn't worthy to wash Beethoven's feet? ;)
2008-02-01 03204, 2008
brianfreud
note to self: never ever ever go see B’s 9th with an even more classical-obsessed gf, then comment afterwards that you could study while listening to it
2008-02-01 03213, 2008
cooperaa_
hahahahahahahahaha
2008-02-01 03244, 2008
cooperaa_
oh that's priceless
2008-02-01 03251, 2008
cooperaa_
on that note, I'm outta here
2008-02-01 03256, 2008
brianfreud
see ya :)
2008-02-01 03256, 2008
cooperaa_
good luck figuring the db stuff out
2008-02-01 03257, 2008
cooperaa_
cya
2008-02-01 03204, 2008
cooperaa_ has quit
2008-02-01 03217, 2008
xlotlu
"c'mon love, i'm just more of a mozart type"
2008-02-01 03226, 2008
brianfreud
I know the moin code’s a bitch, but feel free, anyone, leave comments on that table page I made, and I’ll try to make it work
2008-02-01 03212, 2008
brianfreud
well, I would definitely put Mozart up there, but my all time top classical work isn’t his, I admit
2008-02-01 03222, 2008
brianfreud
K. 626 comes in #2
2008-02-01 03237, 2008
xlotlu
after?
2008-02-01 03246, 2008
brianfreud
Benjamin Britten: War Requiem
2008-02-01 03212, 2008
xlotlu
i never digested Britten
2008-02-01 03227, 2008
brianfreud
Mozart’s Requiem can make you cry. Britten’s War Requiem can devistate you.
2008-02-01 03259, 2008
xlotlu
guess i'll have to give it a try
2008-02-01 03210, 2008
brianfreud
Some of Britten is very wierd... I’ve performed some of his works. But have you ever heard the New York Philharmonic recording of the War Requiem?
2008-02-01 03253, 2008
xlotlu
i don't think i ever heard it. i did some britten experiments years ago, didn't get along, never listened again
2008-02-01 03220, 2008
brianfreud
yeah, this isn’t quite as experimental as his other works
2008-02-01 03222, 2008
xlotlu
it's true though, at that time i never knew what i should listen to, doing random sampling at the library
2008-02-01 03209, 2008
xlotlu
brianfreud: i'm thinking about totally making this a tree
2008-02-01 03213, 2008
brianfreud
yeah. the War Requiem, he wrote a pacifist’s requiem to WW2, using the traditional Requiem text mixed with poetry of Wilfred Owens.
2008-02-01 03223, 2008
brianfreud still random samples :P
2008-02-01 03241, 2008
MrQwerty` joined the channel
2008-02-01 03254, 2008
xlotlu
my entire life is made of random sampling :P
2008-02-01 03217, 2008
brianfreud
but, then, I kind of get Britten... It’s rather telling, I guess, that I can listen to John Cage, and I love Steve Reich...
2008-02-01 03244, 2008
xlotlu
so..
2008-02-01 03218, 2008
xlotlu
"Op. 30" is simply a row; its descendant: "sonata no. 8"; its descendant: "Allegro assai"; and so on, submovements, sub-sub..
2008-02-01 03234, 2008
brianfreud
pretty much
2008-02-01 03202, 2008
xlotlu
and then just figure out how to spit all the tree in a degestable form
2008-02-01 03211, 2008
brianfreud
I guess we just draw the line, since at a certain point the redundancy in text, while perhaps more valid from a db pov, becomes undigestible
2008-02-01 03231, 2008
brianfreud
Just overkill --> 3 German Dances for Orchestra, K. 605: German Dance for Orchestra in C major: German Dance & Trio "Die Schlittenfahrt" & Coda
2008-02-01 03212, 2008
xlotlu
if you put it that way, yeah. but maybe the spitting out will be smarter :)
2008-02-01 03226, 2008
brianfreud
that is the smart spitout, though :P
2008-02-01 03237, 2008
xlotlu
no, that's the straight spitout
2008-02-01 03244, 2008
brianfreud
:P
2008-02-01 03249, 2008
xlotlu
the smart one would be the current form
2008-02-01 03223, 2008
brianfreud
:)
2008-02-01 03248, 2008
xlotlu
this would also make it possible for weirder combined works..
2008-02-01 03209, 2008
xlotlu
.. like that ballet that had each movement written by a different composer
2008-02-01 03239, 2008
brianfreud understands... dealing with an opera by like 6 different composers
2008-02-01 03245, 2008
xlotlu
or 626 :P .../me hides
2008-02-01 03242, 2008
brianfreud
:P
2008-02-01 03251, 2008
brianfreud pulls gun, shoots xlotlu
2008-02-01 03211, 2008
xlotlu queues 626 and pauses amarok
2008-02-01 03201, 2008
xlotlu
think i've mostly figured it out... maybe i'll have something up by monday
