I just have this really silly image of the music files walking up and saying "hey, wanna see my notes? :D"
2006-05-07 12757, 2006
yllona
pbyan: that's a good starting point, but amz clearly states taht the binding TOS is teh copy distributed with the SDk(s)
2006-05-07 12704, 2006
nikki_ blames it on it being almost 6am
2006-05-07 12756, 2006
pbryan
Sorry, I just linked to Amazon, which is theft. Hope BrainzBot decides to filter it out. ;-)
2006-05-07 12706, 2006
nikki_
MBChatLogger is the one logging
2006-05-07 12714, 2006
nikki_
(if it weren't obvious ;))
2006-05-07 12717, 2006
pbryan
s/BrainzBot/MBChatLogger/
2006-05-07 12720, 2006
Nyght
hi nikki and Martin
2006-05-07 12722, 2006
pbryan
;_
2006-05-07 12752, 2006
yllona
pbryan: so you've seen the section in the AMZ TOS - "5. PROVIDING CONTENT TO AMAZON"
2006-05-07 12729, 2006
MartinRudat blinks... (P) MCMXCVIII first time I've seen the year spelt out that way onna CD...
2006-05-07 12707, 2006
MartinRudat wonders if there is a lightning-bolt symbol in unicode...
2006-05-07 12743, 2006
nikki_
probably
2006-05-07 12714, 2006
MartinRudat
well... AC/DC really aught to be written with a lightning bolt.. =)
2006-05-07 12710, 2006
pbryan
yllona: Yes. I can't see everyone agreeing to that term.
2006-05-07 12748, 2006
yllona
a million+ developers and companies have agreed to those terms
2006-05-07 12753, 2006
MBChatLogger
I hate the evil empire
2006-05-07 12753, 2006
pbryan
A million+ users agreed to Microsoft EULAs.
2006-05-07 12702, 2006
MartinRudat
a billion+ people have rice as their stable diet, I can't see everyone agreeing to eat mainly rice...
2006-05-07 12703, 2006
warp
MartinRudat: hm, i've seen that before
2006-05-07 12710, 2006
yllona
have you never seen a media contract, for use/license of image? it's really quite standard stuff, less the IP network issues
2006-05-07 12719, 2006
warp
but i can't remember where,.. and it's somewhat annoying
2006-05-07 12727, 2006
pbryan
I'm not denying that many will agree to it.
2006-05-07 12754, 2006
MartinRudat
warp: on all their cover art? =)
2006-05-07 12700, 2006
pbryan
I just find it strange that the terms of getting an album cover on MB is to agree to Amazon TOS and to get a UPC assigned to the album.
2006-05-07 12707, 2006
pbryan
That's all.
2006-05-07 12717, 2006
pbryan
I understand the pragmatic reasons for it.
2006-05-07 12730, 2006
yllona thinks that both pbryan and martin need to get away from the internet mentality and gain some experience in real world negotiation
2006-05-07 12736, 2006
warp
MartinRudat: yes
2006-05-07 12721, 2006
pbryan
yllona: Do you think I don't appreciate real world negotiation and politics?
2006-05-07 12724, 2006
yllona
pbryan: you need a UPC or pretty much to business with any retailer, otherwise there's no way to track inventory
2006-05-07 12753, 2006
yllona
even an "mom & pop" shop
2006-05-07 12701, 2006
pbryan
yllona: Is that an adequate justification for MB's "sorta-policy" policy?
2006-05-07 12718, 2006
yllona
pbryan: you're off point
2006-05-07 12750, 2006
pbryan
Let me replay the point: A million+ people agree to that contract, and if you want any retailer to stock your item, you must have a UPC, therefore these are the terms of having MB cover art.
2006-05-07 12712, 2006
pbryan
Am I off point?
2006-05-07 12743, 2006
MartinRudat thinks that the artwork licence is a little bit over the top, though... I can see the UPC thing... modern warehouses would find it just about impossible to accomodate non-coded stuff...
2006-05-07 12753, 2006
yllona
yes, you must have a UPC it's part of a larger standardization project than began years ago
2006-05-07 12729, 2006
MartinRudat wonders what's involved with obtaining a UPC...
2006-05-07 12737, 2006
yllona
it's larger and bigger than AMZ (and even the internet), and began long before teh internet was publicly available for commerce
2006-05-07 12739, 2006
MartinRudat 's never really bothered to go and look.
2006-05-07 12746, 2006
yllona
MartinRudat: it's rather easy
2006-05-07 12746, 2006
MartinRudat
I know you apply somewhere for a company code, then issue your own block of numbers, and when you run out ypu apply for more... but if it costs lots of dollars to get a block of numbers...
2006-05-07 12754, 2006
nikki_
pbryan: perhaps mb would consider other places if they have a suitable method of getting data and protect mb from being harrassed by people screaming "OMG MY COPYRIGHT"
2006-05-07 12736, 2006
yllona
example: if your an independent musician CD Baby and/or GEMM will obtain a UPC code for you. it's that simple
2006-05-07 12747, 2006
pbryan
nikki_: I understand the pragmatism involved and appreciate the reminder.
2006-05-07 12711, 2006
yllona
there are other equally as simple solutions forr other types of artists
martin, that assumes you already have a UPC for the item to be sold :)
2006-05-07 12750, 2006
pbryan
MartinRudat: That is easy.
2006-05-07 12717, 2006
yllona
but yeah it's that easy
2006-05-07 12736, 2006
pbryan
yllona: It looks like they assign a code to me.
2006-05-07 12745, 2006
pbryan
You do get a nice TIFF as well though.
2006-05-07 12711, 2006
yllona
that's excellent, teh TIFF
2006-05-07 12701, 2006
MartinRudat
well... you don't really need the TIFF at all, all you need is the number to be registered... though it makes it easier to include on your label if you've got an image all ready to go...
2006-05-07 12739, 2006
yllona
yeah, you really only need a viable UPC number. you could hand-print the number is you're desperate
2006-05-07 12720, 2006
yllona
UPC numbers nd bar codes are separate issues, but UPC numbers were necessary for bar codes to become prevelalent
hmm... ...is the upc all that's needed for amazon to be willing to sell your album, though?
2006-05-07 12743, 2006
yllona
MartinRudat: pretty much that' s the first hurdle. you need to be able to deliver CDs to AMZ within their timelines... and yes they have an automated system to remindo you. you also need to demonstrate permissions from copyright holders, etc. same as any other retailer
2006-05-07 12749, 2006
MartinRudat
hmm... one wonders (not with any real interest) what it takes to sign up as an independant seller/whatever with amazon...
2006-05-07 12759, 2006
yllona
*legitimate retailer
2006-05-07 12730, 2006
yllona
MartinRudat: it's rather straightforward, adn they have an attractive incentive system
2006-05-07 12742, 2006
yllona
like i said a million+ small retailers wouldn't have signed up if it didn't work :)
2006-05-07 12740, 2006
yllona
as i developer though, i suggest you read their API/SDK documentation. it's teh best set of documentation available... check it out for style and completeness. this is absolutely the way it should be done.
2006-05-07 12722, 2006
yllona
but AMZ had a tremendous head start... they started developing the "web services" stuff back in '96 -- long before it was a buzzword. and AMZ also spent teh mony to make sure it happened
2006-05-07 12731, 2006
MartinRudat
...but I'm allergic to documentation! =)
2006-05-07 12748, 2006
yllona
it's been a line item on their annual report since the mid-'90s
Nyght: so i'm guessing that the number of collab artists that would create does not bother you. but in case of Disney is it still correct to assign the collab artists as the artist for different language versions of Disney releases. for instance if a lyricist wrote lyrics in english, should they also be credited on italian version. after all it has italian lyrics
2006-05-07 12716, 2006
nechto13
and the lyricist probably doesn't know italian
2006-05-07 12751, 2006
Nyght
well as of yet you're the only person that seems to give it any "merit".
2006-05-07 12742, 2006
nikki_ grmls about empty artists
2006-05-07 12724, 2006
Nyght
I don't much care about the work, the collab artists are already beginning to become "staggering" just with Disney. (I don't particularly like the soundtrack guidelines as it is, but am trying to figure out a way to "please" both parties.) In some of these instances it's difficult to find the performer, yet less the composer.
2006-05-07 12726, 2006
Nyght
I don't feel feat. orchestra is very appropriate, I do feel lyricists should get credit, and at least a third of the disney is already doing that... but, an AR of translation or original lyricist doesn't seem like it would be too difficult to add to the AR list either.
2006-05-07 12750, 2006
Nyght
Nikki.. sometimes the artists aren't populated because there's still votes being processed. I know that happened a lot with the Disney stuff.
2006-05-07 12756, 2006
nikki_
hmm. I count 236083 artists, 92307 of them have at least one album and 215678 have at least one track
2006-05-07 12714, 2006
nikki_
Nyght: are the artists actually created before the vote is applied?
2006-05-07 12727, 2006
nikki_
and no, in most cases they're performance names or member ofs
2006-05-07 12737, 2006
Nyght
I had to start doing that with mine, because someone was deleting them... so, in some cases they may be.
2006-05-07 12755, 2006
g0llum joined the channel
2006-05-07 12758, 2006
nikki_
hi g0llum
2006-05-07 12703, 2006
nikki_
are you really there?
2006-05-07 12706, 2006
g0llum
time of day
2006-05-07 12709, 2006
nikki_
:o
2006-05-07 12716, 2006
nikki_
I have questions for you
2006-05-07 12723, 2006
Nyght
ah... well.. don't know what to say about that.
2006-05-07 12752, 2006
Nyght
hi g0llum
2006-05-07 12710, 2006
g0llum
hello
2006-05-07 12727, 2006
nechto13
Nyght: i'd think it's easier to find the composer. then again i didn't try to look for performers. i understand it might not be that difficult to find performers for nikelodean shows or mickey mouse club stuff
2006-05-07 12707, 2006
nechto13
then again it's pretty difficult to find a website that breaks it down to composer x, lyricist y
2006-05-07 12740, 2006
nechto13
hello g0llum, how's your day?
2006-05-07 12739, 2006
g0llum
nechto13: thanks for asking. it's ok, you?
2006-05-07 12753, 2006
Nyght
ah, it's really not that difficult to find performers.. I don't know about with classical. I do know that classical/soundtracks are totally the "black sheep" of the database in the way they're handled currently. what I don't know is "why". I imagine it's due to too many people putting too much in the wrong category anyway. :(
2006-05-07 12753, 2006
nechto13
i went to sleep around 10pm today...err yesterday. a first for me, but i woke up in 2 hours and couldn't go back to sleep. yesterday was full of events and meetings so i was borked by 10pm. i had my first accident which was my fault and drove through the most wicked part of thunderstorm teice on my way home
2006-05-07 12714, 2006
nechto13
*twice
2006-05-07 12749, 2006
MartinRudat *prods* amazon... this is a double-CD album... it does not have 43 tracks on the one CD...
2006-05-07 12756, 2006
g0llum
nechto13: sounds like fun :(
2006-05-07 12735, 2006
g0llum
nikki_: should i change things back from "rem" to "del", or write "remove" instead?
2006-05-07 12700, 2006
g0llum
since the release page does not fit 800x600 anyhow, we can live with the additional space it would take
2006-05-07 12734, 2006
nikki_ likes full words best
2006-05-07 12749, 2006
Kerensky97 joined the channel
2006-05-07 12743, 2006
nechto13
g0llum: well, the thunderstorm was fun, probably because i was able to navigate my way out of it and because scary=fun, as long as no one gets hurt that is. the accident wasn't :( but only my car suffered as a result of the accident
2006-05-07 12718, 2006
yllona
nechto13: you've had some very rough weather recently. sorry about the car. at least it wasn't golf ball sized hail while your car was parked in the driveway.
2006-05-07 12731, 2006
g0llum
yes, i happen to like real storms, too.
2006-05-07 12725, 2006
nikki_
I want more storms
2006-05-07 12735, 2006
nikki_
but our weather is lovely right now, nice and cool and wet :)
2006-05-07 12722, 2006
slaad
Ahh, storms.
2006-05-07 12729, 2006
nechto13
yllona: i believe we had golf sized hail either on thursday or friday :) and my car acutally got a very small dent as a result of the accident. i think i hit the other car at no more than 3 miles per hour if not slower
2006-05-07 12737, 2006
yllona
ah, that may not even be worth the hassle of filing an insurance claim, if you're under 30.
2006-05-07 12750, 2006
yllona
male driver + under 30 + accident == pretty much a guarantee for an increase in rates
2006-05-07 12705, 2006
MartinRudat peers at this CD... is the printing in flyspeck 3 _embossed_ or does it just look that way...
