#musicbrainz

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      • fuchs
        we could have used subtitles for this :)

        • 2005-08-31 24329, 2005

      • Shepard is still unsure if all the changes he did at Apocalyptica are correct

        • 2005-08-31 24337, 2005

      • Shepard
        they have a song "Path" and a song "Path vol.2" - the only difference is that the one has a singer and the other is instrumental, so it's not really a volume description

        • 2005-08-31 24307, 2005

      • Shepard
        and i changed them all to "Path, Volume 2" but I guess "Path Volume 2" would have been correct

        • 2005-08-31 24312, 2005

      • fuchs
        should this be fixed -> http://musicbrainz.org/artist/0516f2e3-31ce-4a7a-…

        • 2005-08-31 24350, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: you are doing the dome, so what do you think? :)

        • 2005-08-31 24325, 2005

      • orogor joined the channel

        • 2005-08-31 24306, 2005

      • Daedalus joined the channel

        • 2005-08-31 24342, 2005

      • Shepard
        it was a sense unik track first

        • 2005-08-31 24315, 2005

      • Shepard
        http://musicbrainz.org/showtrack.html?trackid=146… http://musicbrainz.org/showtrack.html?trackid=425…

        • 2005-08-31 24316, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: yeah, I see it in his albums, so it's Unik feat. Fanta4

        • 2005-08-31 24317, 2005

      • Shepard
        http://www.discogs.com/release/126952

        • 2005-08-31 24343, 2005

      • Pipian joined the channel

        • 2005-08-31 24341, 2005

      • Shepard
        hm.. we are missing an artist -> album/track relationship "remastered"

        • 2005-08-31 24333, 2005

      • fuchs
        uh no, not another one of those ugly "remaster" things ;)

        • 2005-08-31 24335, 2005

      • Shepard
        hu?

        • 2005-08-31 24330, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: did you miss my dispute about "remaster" with mo? :)

        • 2005-08-31 24341, 2005

      • Shepard
        seems so

        • 2005-08-31 24331, 2005

      • dholmes
        DAMMIT

        • 2005-08-31 24342, 2005

      • dholmes
        http://musicbrainz.org/showmod.html?modid=3210947

        • 2005-08-31 24358, 2005

      • dholmes
        Another vote failed by clueless vote

        • 2005-08-31 24338, 2005

      • real joined the channel

        • 2005-08-31 24348, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: it starts with "17.08. 21:57 < fuchs> remaster is bad, because it's more a process than a release type - nearly every entry would fit under remaster"

        • 2005-08-31 24309, 2005

      • Shepard
        dholmes: the link you provided does not work for me

        • 2005-08-31 24324, 2005

      • Shepard
        they don't seem to allow direct linking on the covers

        • 2005-08-31 24325, 2005

      • dholmes
        Yeah, it looks like they block direct linking

        • 2005-08-31 24336, 2005

      • dholmes
        But still, that's not grounds for a "no" vote

        • 2005-08-31 24349, 2005

      • dholmes
        I wouldn't have made the mod if it wasn't clearly "II" on the cover :P

        • 2005-08-31 24337, 2005

      • fuchs
        i never touch any japanese looking entries anymore :)

        • 2005-08-31 24345, 2005

      • SenRepus
        SenRepus has joined #MusicBrainz

        • 2005-08-31 24349, 2005

      • Shepard
        fuchs: I don't start reading it yet but is this a reason for not having an _AR_ remaster?

        • 2005-08-31 24310, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: there are more arguments against it ;)

        • 2005-08-31 24321, 2005

      • Shepard
        hm ok

        • 2005-08-31 24329, 2005

      • dholmes
        There isn't even any Japanese in this album title

        • 2005-08-31 24330, 2005

      • Shepard
        too tired to read that now

        • 2005-08-31 24345, 2005

      • DJKC
        Shepard: it depends on whether you're using remaster in the marketing sense or actual sense

        • 2005-08-31 24346, 2005

      • fuchs
        _mo: remix means "contains remixes", remaster means "there was a new medium master created for the pressing"

        • 2005-08-31 24318, 2005

      • DJKC
        fuchs: in one meaning. the point everyone was trying to get across in that discussion was that there's the other marketing meaning

        • 2005-08-31 24320, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: what artist would you take for the artist-track remastering?

        • 2005-08-31 24328, 2005

      • dholmes
        Anyways, vote begging: http://musicbrainz.org/showmod.html?modid=3307536

        • 2005-08-31 24313, 2005

      • fuchs
        DJKC: yeah, I got that, but I still think MB is serious enough not to take over such "wrong" slang meanings ;)

        • 2005-08-31 24319, 2005

      • Shepard
        http://www.xametal.com/skylark/Ealbum-best.htm <- for this compilation it says the songs where remastered by a person

        • 2005-08-31 24357, 2005

      • Shepard
        I always thought it is very clear. remaster for me is if you better the sound quality of a recording and then re-release it

        • 2005-08-31 24307, 2005

      • DJKC
        it's not a wrong meaning, it's just a meaning

        • 2005-08-31 24315, 2005

      • DJKC
        and I'd suspect more people know that meaning than the actual one

        • 2005-08-31 24350, 2005

      • orogor has quit

        • 2005-08-31 24351, 2005

      • DJKC
        it's like complaining when people use the phrase "I was literally <dieing/etc>" when they mean figuratively

        • 2005-08-31 24303, 2005

      • dseomn
        dholmes: shouldn't the "~"s be there?

        • 2005-08-31 24309, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: re-release is fine and much clearer, it can't be missunderstood and covers all the cases we cared about in the discussion :)

        • 2005-08-31 24317, 2005

      • dholmes
        dseomn, maybe

        • 2005-08-31 24350, 2005

      • dholmes
        Is there something in the style guidelines about them? They seem to get removed all the time

        • 2005-08-31 24312, 2005

      • fuchs
        DJKC: yep, but as I said, if there are two different meanings of a term, it's a bad one, especially in cases where better terms exist

        • 2005-08-31 24322, 2005

      • dseomn
        I dunno, but somebody (I think mo or DJKC) told me they should be there

        • 2005-08-31 24340, 2005

      • dholmes
        Deus seems to be pretty clearly a subtitle, so would that make it "Grandia II: ~Deus~" ?

        • 2005-08-31 24303, 2005

      • dseomn
        looks more like "Grandia II: ~ Deus ~" to me

        • 2005-08-31 24343, 2005

      • dseomn
        nvm ~Deus~

        • 2005-08-31 24347, 2005

      • DJKC
        it's not a tilde

        • 2005-08-31 24353, 2005

      • dseomn
        my photographic memory is acting up

        • 2005-08-31 24301, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: those persons are normally not artists but technicians, it's the same as "editor", "director" etc. who don't create (as in creativity) but handle the music in some way

        • 2005-08-31 24306, 2005

      • dholmes
        http://www.cocoebiz.com/iwadare/catalog/trcd10013… leaves it out

        • 2005-08-31 24319, 2005

      • dseomn
        DJKC: is it a tie?

        • 2005-08-31 24316, 2005

      • dholmes
        It's a ～, whatever that is

        • 2005-08-31 24321, 2005

      • DJKC
        I have no idea what the name of that character is, it's just what the �`

        • 2005-08-31 24335, 2005

      • dholmes
        Pick your encoding of choice :P

        • 2005-08-31 24337, 2005

      • DJKC
        wee, don't bump enter in the middle of typing

        • 2005-08-31 24357, 2005

      • fuchs
        it's called a "FULLWIDTH TILDE" U+FF5E

        • 2005-08-31 24325, 2005

      • DJKC
        http://www.excite.co.jp/dictionary/japanese/?sear…

        • 2005-08-31 24337, 2005

      • DJKC
        "wavemark" is the literal translation

        • 2005-08-31 24358, 2005

      • DJKC
        full width namigata

        • 2005-08-31 24316, 2005

      • dholmes
        Anyways, it seems none of the official sites for the album use it, at least as far as I can tell

        • 2005-08-31 24332, 2005

      • Shepard
        fuchs: "artist" in the mb meaning. I mean we have relationships for cover designers and they have to entered in the db as artists as well

        • 2005-08-31 24338, 2005

      • dholmes
        If someone wants to change it I won't stop them, but they should change Povo as well

        • 2005-08-31 24355, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: we have? really? wow :)

        • 2005-08-31 24314, 2005

      • Shepard
        o_O

        • 2005-08-31 24356, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: but wasn't this tging included in the remix/other version proposal anyway?

        • 2005-08-31 24320, 2005

      • Shepard
        take a look at the artist<->album relationships and tell me again that every artist in the db really needs to be a real music artist :)

        • 2005-08-31 24335, 2005

      • Shepard
        dunno

        • 2005-08-31 24339, 2005

      • fuchs
        yeah, i see :)

        • 2005-08-31 24308, 2005

      • fuchs
        hmm, but aren't there very common names? :)

        • 2005-08-31 24339, 2005

      • Shepard
        what do you mean?

        • 2005-08-31 24345, 2005

      • fuchs
        Klaus Müller, Peter Schmidt :)

        • 2005-08-31 24351, 2005

      • Shepard
        so?

        • 2005-08-31 24354, 2005

      • DJKC
        http://musicbrainz.org/album/2f08fc88-87bd-4fb1-9…

        • 2005-08-31 24306, 2005

      • dseomn
        dholmes: I was thinking of "U+0361 COMBINING DOUBLE INVERTED BREVE" which is a tie used in IPA

        • 2005-08-31 24308, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: how do you divide those?

        • 2005-08-31 24331, 2005

      • dholmes
        This is too complicated :P

        • 2005-08-31 24335, 2005

      • Shepard
        duplicate artists if they really appear more than once

        • 2005-08-31 24320, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: yeah, but if you have a cover designer peter müller, how do you know if the other peter müller is the same? you normally only see the name on the cover ;)

        • 2005-08-31 24340, 2005

      • Shepard
        if you don't know, don't add him

        • 2005-08-31 24353, 2005

      • Shepard
        you could mail the band and ask them who he is :)

        • 2005-08-31 24324, 2005

      • fuchs
        hehe, they probably don't know who is responsible for there covers ;)

        • 2005-08-31 24332, 2005

      • fuchs
        *reading the wikiÜ

        • 2005-08-31 24337, 2005

      • Shepard
        "don't you know the famous Peter Müller?"

        • 2005-08-31 24301, 2005

      • fuchs
        Shepard: http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/RemixRelationshipClas… <- you can add it there :)

        • 2005-08-31 24323, 2005

      • fuchs
        in the discussion section or don will go nuts ;)

        • 2005-08-31 24324, 2005

      • DJKC
        it's not really different from adding instrument ARs for releases with large amounts of extra musicians. "Trumpet - Peter Schmidt" on two different albums might be the same generic studio musician or two different guys

        • 2005-08-31 24356, 2005

      • DJKC
        there's probably a good chance that they're the same... and if not, it's likely no one will ever notice ^^

        • 2005-08-31 24304, 2005

      • fuchs
        hehe :)

        • 2005-08-31 24327, 2005

      • fuchs
        yeah, and shepard will clean up the mixed artists later :)

        • 2005-08-31 24338, 2005

      • Shepard
        dumdidum

        • 2005-08-31 24342, 2005

      • Shepard
        nice weather today

        • 2005-08-31 24352, 2005

      • fuchs
        dark it is

        • 2005-08-31 24335, 2005

      • fuchs
        hmm, déjà-vu :)

        • 2005-08-31 24338, 2005

      • Shepard
        uh really.. didn't notice

        • 2005-08-31 24341, 2005

      • Shepard
        hm yes

        • 2005-08-31 24346, 2005

      • Shepard
        and probably us-americans and people from bavaria, austria and switzerland won't agree with me that the weather is nice

        • 2005-08-31 24344, 2005

      • fuchs
        >

        • 2005-08-31 24345, 2005

      • fuchs

        • 2005-08-31 24346, 2005

      • fuchs
        Reports of shootings, carjackings and looting in the area near the Louisiana Superdome, New Orleans, a policeman tells CNN. More soon.

        • 2005-08-31 24352, 2005

      • fuchs
        it's even raining bullets there :/

        • 2005-08-31 24359, 2005

      • DJKC
        it's great here. bad for some friends living ~2000km south

        • 2005-08-31 24359, 2005

      • Shepard
        :\

        • 2005-08-31 24325, 2005

      • DJKC
        everyone sensible is quite a ways out of the area now, but their houses are under 3-4 meters of water

        • 2005-08-31 24346, 2005

      • DJKC
        which makes them a bit irritable on IRC at the moment, understandably

        • 2005-08-31 24306, 2005

      • Shepard
        but still there are people under their attics, aren't?

        • 2005-08-31 24333, 2005

      • Shepard
        *in

        • 2005-08-31 24335, 2005

      • Shepard
        not under

        • 2005-08-31 24342, 2005

      • Shepard
        whatever

        • 2005-08-31 24313, 2005

      • DJKC
        probably. everyone I know basically grabbed their latops and cell phones and then left a while ago

        • 2005-08-31 24340, 2005

      • DJKC
        "I'm emotionally a wreck.. I broke down in the hotel lobby yesteday and just started crying.. my sister's maid-of-honor's husbans refused to leave.. their house is likely up to the room with water.. We hope the hell they left.or went to the last-resort shelter"

        • 2005-08-31 24353, 2005

      • DJKC
        have to love trying to respond to fun messages like that

        • 2005-08-31 24340, 2005

      • DJKC
        dholmes: btw, was just looking, the game arts site lists it with a full width minus

        • 2005-08-31 24348, 2005

      • DJKC
        http://www.gamearts.co.jp/products/grandia2/faq/

        • 2005-08-31 24311, 2005

      • DJKC
        fullwidth minus in one spot, fullwidth namigata in another

        • 2005-08-31 24324, 2005

      • DJKC
        so basically they hate you and any efforts to enter it consistently ^^

        • 2005-08-31 24324, 2005

      • dholmes
        Hm

        • 2005-08-31 24301, 2005

      • dholmes
        It doesn't really look quite right leaving in both the : and the ～

        • 2005-08-31 24325, 2005

      • DJKC
        http://www.twofive.co.jp/25r/13gran2.html record label goes for fullwidth namigata consistently

        • 2005-08-31 24315, 2005

      • dholmes
        They also write the name in katakana, even though there is no katakana on the cover

        • 2005-08-31 24359, 2005

      • DJKC
        yes. pretty much every Japanese page from game arts and the record label write the series name in kaana

        • 2005-08-31 24301, 2005

      • DJKC
        *kana

        • 2005-08-31 24318, 2005

      • dholmes
        Our current entries are translations, but should we use katakana if we were to create a Japanese entry in MB?

        • 2005-08-31 24314, 2005

      • DJKC
        probably not. the games and albums usually write the in English don't they?

        • 2005-08-31 24327, 2005

      • DJKC
        Grandia III is the only one I've played, it has it in English

        • 2005-08-31 24344, 2005

      • dholmes
        Yeah, the logo is english

        • 2005-08-31 24354, 2005

      • dholmes
        I wouldn't know though since I only play the english translations :P

        • 2005-08-31 24313, 2005

      • DJKC
        heh

        • 2005-08-31 24318, 2005

      • DJKC
        the opening logo is GIII

        • 2005-08-31 24323, 2005

      • DJKC
        I kept reading it as Gill

        • 2005-08-31 24338, 2005

      • dholmes
        Is Grandia III good?

        • 2005-08-31 24353, 2005

      • dholmes
        I've been pretty disappointed with most PS2 RPGs; still waiting for a great one

        • 2005-08-31 24300, 2005

      • DJKC
        was probably a sign I shouldn't have started playing it as tired as I was, I fell asleep twice during the opening hour of cut scenes

        • 2005-08-31 24326, 2005

      • DJKC
        hmm, it's enjoyable. Not "OH MY GOD THIS IS THE BEST"

        • 2005-08-31 24331, 2005

      • DJKC
        but good

        • 2005-08-31 24341, 2005

      • DJKC
        I mostly play TRPGs from Nippon Ichi though

        • 2005-08-31 24352, 2005

      • dholmes
        I never really got into those

        • 2005-08-31 24359, 2005

      • DJKC
        so my ability to judge regular ones isn't very good

        • 2005-08-31 24300, 2005

      • dholmes
        I have Disgaea but I've only played a couple hours of it

        • 2005-08-31 24337, 2005

      • DJKC
        ah. after a certain point it's all about raw number manipulation, which is oddly relaxing to my brain

        • 2005-08-31 24349, 2005

      • DJKC
        plus part of me just likes their design philosophy