#musicbrainz

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      • djce
        well, it's not deliberately filtered out anyway. So it failed to match, either because the amazon data wasn't there when it looked, or because the algorithm wasn't good enough to find the match.
      • 2004-12-16 35147, 2004

      • cikkolata
      • 2004-12-16 35153, 2004

      • cikkolata
        single, amazon links
      • 2004-12-16 35114, 2004

      • DJKC
        mmm, algorithm just has problems generating Japanese matches perhaps then...
      • 2004-12-16 35133, 2004

      • djce is away: bye
      • 2004-12-16 35115, 2004

      • dupuy has quit
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      • dupuy joined the channel
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      • CloCKWeRX has quit
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      • rjmunro has quit
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      • ruaok
        26th, at 2pm Pacific/10pm UK/7am Japan? Meeting via conference call and IRC.
      • 2004-12-16 35119, 2004

      • ruaok
        crap. :-(
      • 2004-12-16 35122, 2004

      • ruaok
        morning!
      • 2004-12-16 35117, 2004

      • ruaok
        wow! AR realy looks (and feels) great!
      • 2004-12-16 35118, 2004

      • ruaok
        now that would be an christmas present indeed.
      • 2004-12-16 35145, 2004

      • ruaok
        Music to my ears -- AR still needs some polishing, but if it gets good reviews before that is done, then I'm a happy camper. :-)
      • 2004-12-16 35120, 2004

      • cikkolata
        aww :)
      • 2004-12-16 35155, 2004

      • cikkolata
        btw, is there any reason to not add flags next to country names? (was looking at the rfe list)
      • 2004-12-16 35123, 2004

      • ruaok
        er, I don't want to look at the US flag quite so often?
      • 2004-12-16 35126, 2004

      • ruaok
        (not being serious)
      • 2004-12-16 35130, 2004

      • cikkolata laughs
      • 2004-12-16 35134, 2004

      • ruaok
        I'm sure we could. :-)
      • 2004-12-16 35151, 2004

      • cikkolata
        it seems like it would be ridiculously simple.
      • 2004-12-16 35108, 2004

      • ruaok
        do you know where we can get those under the GPL or so?
      • 2004-12-16 35126, 2004

      • cikkolata looks at dupuy
      • 2004-12-16 35143, 2004

      • cikkolata
        he was adding a page on the wiki with flags
      • 2004-12-16 35137, 2004

      • granville joined the channel
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      • granville has quit
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      • yalaforge joined the channel
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      • dupuy
      • 2004-12-16 35101, 2004

      • dupuy
        unfortunately, when I load the page, the flags from 33ff.com don't seem to load properly
      • 2004-12-16 35108, 2004

      • cikkolata
        they don't for me either
      • 2004-12-16 35124, 2004

      • dupuy
        and you may need to visit that site to get them in your browser cache first
      • 2004-12-16 35154, 2004

      • dupuy
        I'll probably re-host copies of the .gif files to my web area (as I did with some other random flags)
      • 2004-12-16 35109, 2004

      • dupuy
        the 33ff.com flags are not GPL
      • 2004-12-16 35132, 2004

      • dupuy
        however, we can use them as long as we have a link to the 33ff.com page on our site
      • 2004-12-16 35111, 2004

      • dupuy
        the larger 30 pixel high flags are available for non-commercial use
      • 2004-12-16 35143, 2004

      • yalaforge
        which violates gpl as well :-(
      • 2004-12-16 35103, 2004

      • dupuy
        how does commercial use violate gpl?
      • 2004-12-16 35111, 2004

      • cikkolata
        I imagine there has to be *some* out there though.
      • 2004-12-16 35136, 2004

      • dupuy
        you can even sell gpl code, as long as you make the source available at reasonable distribution cost
      • 2004-12-16 35138, 2004

      • yalaforge
        read the gpl, I think there's a non-discriminating clause in there
      • 2004-12-16 35156, 2004

      • yalaforge
        yes, but you mustn't prohibit commercial use
      • 2004-12-16 35111, 2004

      • yalaforge
        and you do that if you say 'free for non-commercial use'
      • 2004-12-16 35102, 2004

      • dupuy
        I still don't see how that prevents us from using the flags ourselves
      • 2004-12-16 35126, 2004

      • yalaforge
        it doesn't. you just can't use them under gpl :-)
      • 2004-12-16 35152, 2004

      • DJKC
        why not use public domain ones?
      • 2004-12-16 35158, 2004

      • DJKC
      • 2004-12-16 35159, 2004

      • dupuy
        you saying that gpl code can't use them?
      • 2004-12-16 35104, 2004

      • DJKC
      • 2004-12-16 35115, 2004

      • yalaforge
        dupuy: yes, but I'm no lawyer
      • 2004-12-16 35117, 2004

      • yalaforge
        (thank god)
      • 2004-12-16 35130, 2004

      • cikkolata
        DJKC: those are kinda too big though
      • 2004-12-16 35133, 2004

      • DJKC
        unless I'm misreading the copyright info there those should be public domain and usable by anyone...
      • 2004-12-16 35143, 2004

      • dupuy
        yes - we really need quite small ones
      • 2004-12-16 35100, 2004

      • DJKC
        so set image size in the link?
      • 2004-12-16 35105, 2004

      • cikkolata
        no
      • 2004-12-16 35119, 2004

      • cikkolata
        scaling would look /awful/
      • 2004-12-16 35129, 2004

      • cikkolata
        hold on, I made it do stuff
      • 2004-12-16 35131, 2004

      • cikkolata scps
      • 2004-12-16 35107, 2004

      • dupuy
        scaling works up to a point
      • 2004-12-16 35116, 2004

      • dupuy
        but it really depends on the flag
      • 2004-12-16 35134, 2004

      • cikkolata
      • 2004-12-16 35136, 2004

      • dupuy
        (small or complex elements look terrible)
      • 2004-12-16 35139, 2004

      • cikkolata
        sorry it's fullscreen too.
      • 2004-12-16 35156, 2004

      • dupuy
        personally, I would use the small flags *instead of* the country names on the compact listing
      • 2004-12-16 35100, 2004

      • DJKC
        well, against a white background that will almost always
      • 2004-12-16 35110, 2004

      • dupuy
        but not in addition to
      • 2004-12-16 35120, 2004

      • DJKC
        errr, aren't people more likely to know the country name than the flag?
      • 2004-12-16 35127, 2004

      • cikkolata
        yeah :/
      • 2004-12-16 35159, 2004

      • dupuy
        flag takes up less space
      • 2004-12-16 35118, 2004

      • DJKC
        they do, but if no one knows them you kind of lose the benefit of tagging what country it's from
      • 2004-12-16 35119, 2004

      • dupuy
        which in the compact listing is an issue
      • 2004-12-16 35120, 2004

      • cikkolata
        I was impressed that I made it do something without making it blow up.
      • 2004-12-16 35147, 2004

      • dupuy
        you can make the flag a link to a popup with the country name
      • 2004-12-16 35101, 2004

      • dupuy
        and people will learn them
      • 2004-12-16 35115, 2004

      • cikkolata
        you have too much faith in people, I think.
      • 2004-12-16 35131, 2004

      • dupuy
        most people recognize the US & UK flags, so 90% of all the flag icons on the site will be recognizable
      • 2004-12-16 35141, 2004

      • cikkolata
        70%
      • 2004-12-16 35146, 2004

      • cikkolata counted!
      • 2004-12-16 35157, 2004

      • cikkolata
        I think it was actually 71.something...
      • 2004-12-16 35105, 2004

      • DJKC
        from helping run a tracker in the past with a lot of asian users that just showed the flag and you had to mouse over to find the country name, it gets really annoying rather quickly to not have the name
      • 2004-12-16 35127, 2004

      • DJKC
        I learned the flags for Malaysia, Thailand, Philipines, etc pretty quickly but most people won't bother I'd think...
      • 2004-12-16 35137, 2004

      • dupuy
        you could combine the flag and ISO-3166 code for a small-fixed size & easily recognized representation
      • 2004-12-16 35149, 2004

      • dupuy
        e.g. [flag] GB
      • 2004-12-16 35120, 2004

      • DJKC
        that'd be a lot nicer
      • 2004-12-16 35133, 2004

      • dupuy
        mouseover with the full name (some of them are quite long)
      • 2004-12-16 35145, 2004

      • cikkolata
        which bit are we actually talking about?
      • 2004-12-16 35155, 2004

      • dupuy
        and you have a good, compact, and comprehensible representation
      • 2004-12-16 35103, 2004

      • DJKC
        cikkolata: as a random shift of topic - Lee Jung Hyun just released her first single in Japan that's covers of a few of her Korean ones in Japanese. It's quite good if you're a fan of her at all
      • 2004-12-16 35154, 2004

      • cikkolata
        never heard her music :/
      • 2004-12-16 35131, 2004

      • DJKC
        ah
      • 2004-12-16 35145, 2004

      • DJKC
        most English speakers know her from DDR
      • 2004-12-16 35114, 2004

      • DJKC
        one of those annoying/interesting things - her English name doesn't remotely match her Japanese one
      • 2004-12-16 35146, 2004

      • DJKC
      • 2004-12-16 35141, 2004

      • cikkolata
        I can see where they got that from
      • 2004-12-16 35104, 2004

      • granville joined the channel
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      • granville has quit
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      • dupuy
        another artist with a "broken" sortname (from the japanese perspective :-)
      • 2004-12-16 35107, 2004

      • cikkolata ponders whether it's actually pronounced lee
      • 2004-12-16 35103, 2004

      • dupuy
        korean is somewhat related to japanese, it's probably a semivowel between /l/ and /r/ somewhat like japanese
      • 2004-12-16 35131, 2004

      • cikkolata
        I mean... in korean it's written "i", but most people romanise it as "lee"
      • 2004-12-16 35149, 2004

      • dupuy
        maybe from the chinese?
      • 2004-12-16 35157, 2004

      • cikkolata
        no idea
      • 2004-12-16 35142, 2004

      • cikkolata
        and afaik, korean has both l and r
      • 2004-12-16 35148, 2004

      • cikkolata
        but I'm no expert on korean :/
      • 2004-12-16 35100, 2004

      • cikkolata
        I want to learn korean, but nowhere wants to teach it.
      • 2004-12-16 35105, 2004

      • cikkolata
        same for russian, for that matter.
      • 2004-12-16 35108, 2004

      • dupuy
        yalaforge: check out the artist annotation on tori amos
      • 2004-12-16 35112, 2004

      • cikkolata
        everywhere I asked had cancelled it.
      • 2004-12-16 35118, 2004

      • DJKC
        http://www.audioscrobbler.com/music/%EC%9D%B4%EC%… there's the actual korean for her name, which apparently the hangul would normally be transliterated along the lines of Ee Chong Hyon
      • 2004-12-16 35147, 2004

      • DJKC
        http://musicbrainz.org/artist/d1eb9201-f7fb-401f-… Lee is the official english spelling she uses though
      • 2004-12-16 35108, 2004

      • DJKC
        but kind of interesting that her Japanese official site says Lee for the English but has i in the transliteration into katakana -_-
      • 2004-12-16 35118, 2004

      • cikkolata
        I know what the korean is (I'd write it as i jeong hyeon), which is why I was pondering whether they actually say it differently or whether they just like using lee for a name pronounced "ee"
      • 2004-12-16 35102, 2004

      • ruaok is away: playing director for someone else's non-profit
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      • lgonze joined the channel
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      • yalaforge
        dupuy: yup, I noticed it already
      • 2004-12-16 35144, 2004

      • yalaforge
      • 2004-12-16 35110, 2004

      • yalaforge
        even after the 'Rechtschreibreform', '�' may appear at the end of words (and of course in the middle)
      • 2004-12-16 35123, 2004

      • dupuy
        unless it is the case that in post-reform rules it may appears at the end of a word after a short vowel, I think what I wrote is not incorrect
      • 2004-12-16 35148, 2004

      • dupuy
        really, what i was trying to convey was a general sense of the rules, and an idea that they have changed
      • 2004-12-16 35108, 2004

      • dupuy
        which I think I managed to do
      • 2004-12-16 35146, 2004

      • yalaforge
        in post-reform rules, 'da�' was correct, which is a '�' at the end of a word after a short vowel
      • 2004-12-16 35133, 2004

      • dupuy
        would it be sufficient to add "and" before "depending"? (i.e. (only after a long vowel or at the end of a word, and depending on which [German spelling rules] you use)
      • 2004-12-16 35112, 2004

      • yalaforge re-reads the wiki page
      • 2004-12-16 35136, 2004

      • dupuy thinks it might be easier for yalaforge to just make the necessary changes
      • 2004-12-16 35143, 2004

      • yalaforge
        ok
      • 2004-12-16 35121, 2004

      • dupuy reads the musicbrainz-users digest and wonders why everybody thinks the Rechtschreibreform eliminated ß entirely
      • 2004-12-16 35135, 2004

      • yalaforge
        that's a common mistake
      • 2004-12-16 35112, 2004

      • yalaforge
        the '�' is only converted to 'ss' after a short vowel
      • 2004-12-16 35120, 2004

      • yalaforge
        maybe there are exceptions, but I don't know any
      • 2004-12-16 35126, 2004

      • yalaforge
        unfortunately, the reform made some changes that make the written language lose semantics
      • 2004-12-16 35130, 2004

      • yalaforge
        what a mess
      • 2004-12-16 35136, 2004

      • dupuy wonders if it's necessary to have a comment on the ß in the German text
      • 2004-12-16 35107, 2004

      • yalaforge
        I don't care
      • 2004-12-16 35140, 2004

      • yalaforge
        most germans don't know the rules exactly. non-germans don't have any chances to do it right ;-)
      • 2004-12-16 35133, 2004

      • lgonze has quit
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      • yalaforge has quit
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      • grin_k1tt3n joined the channel
      • 2004-12-16 35140, 2004

      • grin_k1tt3n
        ah, finally
      • 2004-12-16 35116, 2004

      • grin_k1tt3n
        doesn't like periods, it seems
      • 2004-12-16 35151, 2004

      • cikkolata
        what doesn't?
      • 2004-12-16 35154, 2004

      • cikkolata
        irc?
      • 2004-12-16 35124, 2004

      • DJKC
        men?
      • 2004-12-16 35139, 2004

      • cikkolata giggles
      • 2004-12-16 35154, 2004

      • ruaok suspects the tagger
      • 2004-12-16 35126, 2004

      • cikkolata sighs
      • 2004-12-16 35133, 2004

      • cikkolata
        is there /any/ way to find stuff in freedb?
      • 2004-12-16 35155, 2004

      • dupuy
        the advanced search sort of works for latin-1
      • 2004-12-16 35104, 2004

      • dupuy
        beyond that, nope
      • 2004-12-16 35131, 2004

      • dupuy
        (well, if you had a FreeDB client that you could feed a disc or disc id to)