#musicbrainz

Latin != English.

ojnkpjg, normally I apply style to transliterated tracks, but leave track that are in latin from beginning alone.

why don't we do that for all releases, then?

I normally treat transliterated versions as unofficial and therefore liable for guess casing, even if the title was originally in english

if people want the official capitalisations, they can use the official track list

nikki: me too.

it avoids some absurd looking releases with half and half.

ojnkpjg, no objections. nikki, why change caps if correct form is known already?

nikki: Because when half of my song tags have been botched by VBRfix, and I finally find a way to fix all of them, to find out that some of the tags are missing capitalization, and then I'm told 'Waaa. It isn't supposed to have English capitalization.'

rowaasr13: because it's unofficial and not what the people using those versions want

Well.

I have an idea that may end this.

How latin TRACK names suddenly become unofficial in transliterated release?

Two different albums that may end this.

the track list is unofficial, it doesn't appear on a CD like that

even if it did, though

One, the botched job at capitalizations, or lack of.

Landus: well, we already have two albums for this one, we don't need a third :/

why ought japanese get a pass on titles in english

Then another with the correct track names with English capitalization.

i have plenty of cds where all text is lowercase

and the record label's website has it in lowercase

but we still apply the english capitalization standards

Because the conversion is 'in English'.

rowaasr13: do you use the transliterated versions of the albums?#

ojnkpjg: because of consistency. When all japanese net and media says one thing and you suddenly stand to say something else, you're, usually, not right.

nikki, for file names.

If you convert something from English to Spanish, are you going to follow all of the same languages precedent found in English?

do you save everything twice then? o_O

Landus, it is not translation, it is romanization.

hi yllona

hello shep & nikki

Fast way to end this.

hi yllona

Give everyone in the U.S. a copy of the track names in lowercase.

See how many people consider it to be incorrect.

EOM.

Why should I care? Lots of people in America think they fought USSR in WW2.

?

WW2 details != track names

Many people who would consider it "incorrect" could be as easily "incorrect" themselves.

English is the offical language in the U.S.

no it isn

't

What is, then?

nothing is

there is none

It is in Utah...

No, it's official, but other languages are accepted.

Note if you want to bre an American citizen, you need to be able to speak and understand English.

Well, english is official in US and russian is official there. Because it is official, I demand everyone to use russian rules.

Sounds good?

But the track names aren't in Russian.

:)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA <- this, at least, says there's no official language

They're in English.

o_O!

are you talking about a classical album?

No.

So what? English -> used in US -> I'm from US -> I decide rules? Is that decision chain?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_the_U... and also this

rowaasr13, it's not about that, it's that we have explicit capitalization guidelines for english on musicbrainz

nikki: wikipedia is not a good reference for this argument ;)

Used, rather.

yllona: I trust wikipedia more than some random guy on irc

Nikki.

ojnkpjg: that clearly says that they don't apply to tracks intentionally named with some unusual capitalization.

I could've been the last person to change that Wikipedia entry?

Are you still going to trust it?

Even though there's a chance that everything on it is what I say.

Wikiality

right, but how do you know that it's intentional

how do you know that anybody involved in the printing of the cover, or whatever, cares at all

:)

Have I repeat all the speech about "consistency" for third time?

nikki: Just wanted you to make you think for a second.

i think it'd be better to be self-consistent than consistent with some vague somethign or other

I know fully well that you could change it, but obviously you didn't, because it contradicts what you say

Good point.

I can find better sources, I'm sure

well, I could, if I weren't using dialup making everything slower than a dead snail

wikipedia was the only thing I could think of which

I knew said that off the top of my head

Well.

This is going to sound sad.

But I woke up at 10 this morning.

ojnkpjg, then MB no longer will be "music metadatabase that attempts to create a comprehensive music information site", but a DB of music how MB editors see it.

Started sorting my music.

rowaasr13, that's how it is already for a bunch of other releases, despite what's printed on the covers

rowaasr13: That's because it's impossible for it to be completely comprehensive.

http://musicbrainz.org/release/5e63908c-f729-41... <- I still like this one :D

Back to what I was saying.

I've been debating this for nearly 5 or 6 hours.

okay hang on: here's the official policy on "New Americans": "provide direction to executive departments and agencies (agencies) concerning the integration into American society of America's legal immigrants, particularly through instruction in English, civics, and history;"

I need to eat.

Even if it isn't 100% possible, I do not see reasons to work against this goal.

it obviously isn't a goal of MB to duplicate tracklistings on covers

as we change things like (Part 1) to , Part 1

isn't self-consistency the reason we have style guidelines in the first place

if we just duplicated what was on covers, we'd not need just about all of them

UE|sleepingtiem is now known as UserErr0r

Heh, thank your western producers that can't agree with each other. Most japanese releases just don't need this. I really hope one day all this info will be pushed from tracks to special fields and names would be left alone.

i agree with rowaasr13 about the special fields

^

I could settle with that.

Both sides get what they want.

Isn't that kind of where official and unofficil releases are going? Since we don't have that ability yet?

*unofficial

i think it's be a gigantic waste of space to store different capitization schemes for titles in the db

capitalization, too

ojnkpjg, as far as I understand there will be just generic solution for any number of unofficial aliases you want for track name.

ok, well, all i'm saying is that if !strcasecmp(x,y) then i think it's a waste of space to store x and y

https://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/g... doesn't list english as an official language

there is no official language :P

ojnkpjg: I know, but apparently wikipedia isn't good enough

i know this mostly because every once in a while there is a vocal minority clamoring for english to be elevated to that status

so I'm providing more proof :P

ojnkpjg, well I too think so, but as long as there will good way to tag each alias with type showing what kind of original name transformation this is, I have absolutely nothing about any number of those aliases.

s/about/against/

How big is the MB database BTW?

Like in Gigs

6 or 7?

something like that

that's not bad considering 1) all the db schema fluff 2) EVERYTHING IN THERE

then again, text compresses like mad

Yeah my music takes up more space than that. By about 15 times.

:)

Last.fm radio is acting up, it just played the same artist back to back. Isn't that against the radio streaming licence?

nikki: on last thing on official language for the US: each of the 50 states can establish it's on language policy. it's a *very hot* issue in all of the states west of the MIssissippi River

wb mo

http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?cod... <- also doesn't list it as official

Kerensky97: yes, but it could be a technical difficulty... and the licensing is slightly diffrent in the UK

yllona: yup, but overall there is none for the entire country

but it's moveing that way --- very rapidly

My state is a bunch of retards.

especially in the current adminsitratino

You'd think this country wasn't made up of immigrants.

yllona: but that's not what we're arguing about ;

;)

nikki: i'm saying that english may become official before the next presidential election ;)